Talismanic Devices and Imbuements on Islamic Arms

[Victrix]

Originally Posted by Kubur

Gentlemens at this stage of the discussion
I would like to share with you one of the most important fact:
a line is made of two points.

Are you saying we are getting a bit ”dotty” here??

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

I hesitate to add that we are also going around in circles !!

The question of dots is hardly touched here but the general Talisman focuss I think is well being advanced>> The mathematical wizardry involved in astrology we have hardly noted yet it is vast and pulls in all the mysterious Talisman and magical wonders described by my illustration of the Swordsman built from a star chart in Persia in the early11thC.

Shown below;from the Suwar al-kawakib al-thabita of al-Sufi dated1009-10

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

For a final thrust from the side of proof and discussion looking from the Ottoman advantage I offer the book of Iznic Patterns from more than 10 of the worlds finest museums and 650 plus diagrams and pictures where the chinthimani/ cintimanii gets two full pages dedicated to patterns of Iznic ceramics. The period is known as RHODEAN and covers the early 17th C in artisan production there.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Here is the book I spoke about above > and the early 17thC Rhodian period patterns; Chintamani

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

KOUMIYYA with hand in silver(Hand of Fatima) decorating and protecting the weapon from evil; Moroccan superstition is bang up to date in the 21st century with such myths and legends and tradition is alive with ancient beliefs.

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by Ibrahiim al Balooshi

KOUMIYYA with hand in silver(Hand of Fatima) decorating and protecting the weapon from evil; Moroccan superstition is bang up to date in the 21st century with such myths and legends and tradition is alive with ancient beliefs.

This is a great representation of the use of the hand in Islamic talisman context. While this theme seems to be present broadly through the Dar al-Islam, it does seem to be represented in other manner geometically as in the shape of a triangle. In Central Asia this become a device known as the "Afghan Amulet' (if I recall there is a book by that title) which was used in similar context.
In the Sahara, the Kabyles used the triangular shape in a linear fashion on their familiar 'flyssa' swords and these along with other devices were intended in apotropaic fashion in the 'folk' religions nominally aligned with Islamic Faith.

These traditions extend through the Maghreb which of course include Morocco, and much of the Berber sphere.

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by Ibrahiim al Balooshi

Here is the book I spoke about above > and the early 17thC Rhodian period patterns; Chintamani

This is truly an intriguing look into use of the 'cintamani' device so well known in 'Oriental' textiles applied in the design motifs on this pottery. From what I understand the term Iznic refers to the town in the 'Asia Minor' regions (Western Anatolia) and as well noted, the pottery they were known for.
The Ottoman empire of course transmitted this as well as many such artistic influences through their trade and colonization.

Excellent perspective in a venue I had not thought of, and well illustrates the many aspects of material culture outside the arms context which can help us learn more on the markings we find on them .

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by Victrix

Are you saying we are getting a bit ”dotty” here??

Good quip Victrix!

Indeed 'connecting the dots' can be a bit maddening as we try to make sense out of these conundrums, and as Ibrahiim has noted.....we can often seem to be going in circles ......but these discussions can systematically map out the situations and circustances for better investigation.

The knowledge base and diversity of the membership here is phenomenal, and there is no better place to bring these things into the light.


We all share in the adventure.......and 'the games afoot!!'.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Thank you Jim for balancing the thread so far. I was reading about Tipu Sultan (The Tiger of Mysore) and noted Talisman devices on the famous cannon also decorated in Tigers …from http://www.mia.org.qa/en/tigers-dream/tipu-cannon

Quote"
The triumphant lion of God.

Like many other objects in this exhibition, this cannon is laden with tigers and inscriptions. The tiger motif is most forcefully expressed by the snarling tiger heads at the muzzle (front), trunnions (on the sides) and cascabel (back) of the gun barrel. Within a pair of tiger stripes on the barrel, an inscription calls on the ‘triumphant lion of God’, a phrase found regularly in calligraphic designs of this period. This inscription also provides the place and date of manufacture, while the presence of the heart-shaped ‘Haydar’ talisman shows that the cannon was cast at the sultan’s foundry".Unquote.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Broadening the search I have to include Alem >>>THe Islamic battle standard that also spread onto some blades SEE https://no.pinterest.com/pin/2568459...64161/?lp=true

And for a bladed example On a Safavid sword below;

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

In searching for the perfect battle scene where the Alam is deployed as a battle banner in the role as a Psychological weapon I found this in https://www.metmuseum.org/exhibitions/past-exhibitions

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by Ibrahiim al Balooshi

In searching for the perfect battle scene where the Alam is deployed as a battle banner in the role as a Psychological weapon I found this in https://www.metmuseum.org/exhibitions/past-exhibitions

Yet another amazing illustration!! Thank you for all the time you spend seeking all of these to help us better understand many of the salient points you place in these threads.

I am a bit puzzled on the 'alem', which is an item not often covered in discussions of Islamic arms. I had thought it was a metal device usually placed atop a pole, in the manner of a polearm or spear and was used as a guidon in forming and directing bodies of troops.

These it seems were often lavished with elaborate Quranic passages and symbolism (much as thuluth covered examples in Sudan), but I was not aware these included textile banners.


The talismanic (psychological) properties are clear however, as these kinds of inscriptions and invocations compel warriors as they move forward into battle.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Thanks Jim, I read that banners or more likely pennants were tied beneath Alam finials and soaked in the enemys blood would greatly empower the battle ensign (alam_) … See https://www.bing.com/images/search?...iri&FORM=HDRSC2 Below~

An interesting depiction of a procession typical of those of pilgrims going to Mecca with flags waving covered in emblems of their faith ...this was recorded as 13thC. It would seem reasonable that battle Alams would incorporate smaller pennants attached for added Talismanic power and inspired by similar religious flag inscriptions.

On closer inspection note Alam and flags as well as pennants are tied to the Alam poles.