Morocco dagger!

mariusgmioc · 6th July 2017, 02:31 PM

Hello Stefan,

Not only the blade, but also the hilt with the kitchish red "gem" is shouting: "kitch for unsuspecting tourists!"

You can start just browsing the web and looking at the photos for "koummya dagger." In the photos, you can examine differences in the quality of materials and mostly workmanship.

Better yet, just have a look at the very educative article right on this forum:

www.vikingsword.com/ethsword/koummya/index.html

corrado26 · 6th July 2017, 03:32 PM

I think, that this was an older koummya because the scabbard is looking good. But the old hilt was obviously missing and the original blade broken. or rusty So they added a frankly said cruel new hilt and a bad blade. Just good for the dustbin
corrado26

Hombre · 6th July 2017, 09:01 PM

Thank you all!

I will continue looking!

Best,
Stefan

motan · 6th July 2017, 09:12 PM

Hi Stefan,
Unfortunately, I have to agree with Ariel and mariusgmioc. This is a tourist piece. You can read a very recent thread over koummya that I started about 10 days ago and many others have contributed knowledge, sources and some very good examples.

shayde78 · 6th July 2017, 10:17 PM

I am by NO means an expert (novice is more accurate). Still, here are my two cents

I agree the scabbard seems of better quality that the rest. I think when Ariel indicates an issue with the blade, the issue is it appears to be pretty two-dimensional. There doesn't seem to be much of a clear bevel, and the cross section seems consistent with thin bar stock/sheet steel. Rather than being forged, it was probably ground down to shape. The hilt seems overdone with the nail heads and the 'gem'. There might be some components of the hilt with some age, but I suspect the nails and gem are much more recent embellishments. Take a look at the second set of pictures here, for some guidance on exactly this topic: http://vikingsword.com/ethsword/guide.html

As to your original question of "is this dagger a good start", that is up to you. If the price is right, and you have an idea of what you're actually getting, this could be a good start, and will give you a sense of what to look for in future items you might like to pick up.

Good luck!

Jim McDougall · 7th July 2017, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shayde78

I am by NO means an expert (novice is more accurate). Still, here are my two cents

I agree the scabbard seems of better quality that the rest. I think when Ariel indicates an issue with the blade, the issue is it appears to be pretty two-dimensional. There doesn't seem to be much of a clear bevel, and the cross section seems consistent with thin bar stock/sheet steel. Rather than being forged, it was probably ground down to shape. The hilt seems overdone with the nail heads and the 'gem'. There might be some components of the hilt with some age, but I suspect the nails and gem are much more recent embellishments. Take a look at the second set of pictures here, for some guidance on exactly this topic: http://vikingsword.com/ethsword/guide.html

As to your original question of "is this dagger a good start", that is up to you. If the price is right, and you have an idea of what you're actually getting, this could be a good start, and will give you a sense of what to look for in future items you might like to pick up.

Good luck!

Shayde, that is beautifully explained, which is excellent in helping in understanding the dynamics which lead to the proper evaluation of this dagger. Although not of course the assessment Hombre had likely hoped for, it is truly helpful to have these insights, which is most informative for us all.

It is often very difficult to identify many weapons forms and their variants, and helps a great deal when such details considered are explained.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 8th July 2017, 12:03 AM

Please see http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=22848 which is the forum site Motan is referring to... Your pictures show a dagger made with a hot needle in tailoring terms !! ... thus you will be better off waiting to see a better one ... with more skill in the making.

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

rickystl · 8th July 2017, 04:39 PM

While not in my area of collecting, I do own one Koummya. And I thought I would post it here on this Thread for opinions. The Links posted above were most helpful. So here are a bunch of pics. Overall, this appears to be a typical, well made Koummya that was carried in general use. The brass cover on the scabbard and handle are fairly heavy. The blade seems to be of good quality with good cutting edges, but a bit dull from age. There is a smaller amount of engraving on the back side versus the front. Scabbard slightly bent at the tip. Scabbard and handle need a bit of cleaning which I will attend to. Of course the colored shoulder rope was added by myself. But the dagger does appear to have been carried in use. As far as age, based on what I've read, I'm guessing early 20th Century. Does that appear to be correct? Thanks for any comments.

Rick

rickystl · 8th July 2017, 04:41 PM

MORE PICS.............

Sajen · 9th July 2017, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickystl

And I thought I would post it here on this Thread for opinions. .... As far as age, based on what I've read, I'm guessing early 20th Century. Does that appear to be correct?

Hello Rick,

I am really no expert regarding this sort of daggers but I see a nice, authentic and "tribal" used dagger with a lot of wear and old repairs, the bend tip of the scabbard I've seen before by old and used pieces. Like Motan said, not a rich mans example but truly a collectible ethnographic dagger with interesting blade. Sorry Stefan, but I think that this one would be a better start to collect koumayas. A better piece with silver will cost more, even today!

Regards,
Detlef

8th July 2017, 04:39 PM	#8
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,632	While not in my area of collecting, I do own one Koummya. And I thought I would post it here on this Thread for opinions. The Links posted above were most helpful. So here are a bunch of pics. Overall, this appears to be a typical, well made Koummya that was carried in general use. The brass cover on the scabbard and handle are fairly heavy. The blade seems to be of good quality with good cutting edges, but a bit dull from age. There is a smaller amount of engraving on the back side versus the front. Scabbard slightly bent at the tip. Scabbard and handle need a bit of cleaning which I will attend to. Of course the colored shoulder rope was added by myself. But the dagger does appear to have been carried in use. As far as age, based on what I've read, I'm guessing early 20th Century. Does that appear to be correct? Thanks for any comments. Rick Attached Images

8th July 2017, 04:41 PM	#9
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,632	MORE PICS............. Attached Images

6th July 2017, 02:31 PM	#1
mariusgmioc Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Austria Posts: 1,911	Hello Stefan, Not only the blade, but also the hilt with the kitchish red "gem" is shouting: "kitch for unsuspecting tourists!" You can start just browsing the web and looking at the photos for "koummya dagger." In the photos, you can examine differences in the quality of materials and mostly workmanship. Better yet, just have a look at the very educative article right on this forum: www.vikingsword.com/ethsword/koummya/index.html

6th July 2017, 03:32 PM	#2
corrado26 Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Black Forest, Germany Posts: 1,231	I think, that this was an older koummya because the scabbard is looking good. But the old hilt was obviously missing and the original blade broken. or rusty So they added a frankly said cruel new hilt and a bad blade. Just good for the dustbin corrado26

6th July 2017, 09:01 PM	#3
Hombre Member Join Date: Dec 2015 Posts: 232	Thank you all! I will continue looking! Best, Stefan

6th July 2017, 09:12 PM	#4
motan Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Jerusalem Posts: 274	Hi Stefan, Unfortunately, I have to agree with Ariel and mariusgmioc. This is a tourist piece. You can read a very recent thread over koummya that I started about 10 days ago and many others have contributed knowledge, sources and some very good examples.

6th July 2017, 10:17 PM	#5
shayde78 Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 445	I am by NO means an expert (novice is more accurate). Still, here are my two cents I agree the scabbard seems of better quality that the rest. I think when Ariel indicates an issue with the blade, the issue is it appears to be pretty two-dimensional. There doesn't seem to be much of a clear bevel, and the cross section seems consistent with thin bar stock/sheet steel. Rather than being forged, it was probably ground down to shape. The hilt seems overdone with the nail heads and the 'gem'. There might be some components of the hilt with some age, but I suspect the nails and gem are much more recent embellishments. Take a look at the second set of pictures here, for some guidance on exactly this topic: http://vikingsword.com/ethsword/guide.html As to your original question of "is this dagger a good start", that is up to you. If the price is right, and you have an idea of what you're actually getting, this could be a good start, and will give you a sense of what to look for in future items you might like to pick up. Good luck!

8th July 2017, 12:03 AM	#7
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	Please see http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=22848 which is the forum site Motan is referring to... Your pictures show a dagger made with a hot needle in tailoring terms !! ... thus you will be better off waiting to see a better one ... with more skill in the making. Regards, Ibrahiim al Balooshi.