Filipino/Moro Martial Arts question...

[Dimasalang]

Originally Posted by Dimasalang

After reading the entire thread from where that quote came from, it looks like it was written by Celestino "Tinni" Macachor(who is based out of Cebu). Aside from being a researching historian, he is also one of the pillars of De Campo JDC-IO. He is the co-author of the book, Cebuano Eskrima: Beyond the Myth...which delves heavily in to the history of Visayan eskrima. I actually have this book and it is extremely deep. But I have only read a few of the chapters...I think I'll have to sit down now and read it in its entirety. You can also email Tinni Macachor at ambangmac53@yahoo.com. I think I need to send him a few emails.

Just to mention, I have been reading this book. And wow, there is a wealth of information on how FMA came to be. I strongly suggest reading this book if you are curious on the development of FMA(particularly eskrima from the Visayas region) during the Spanish/Moro era. Everything just makes so much more sense to me. Not everything in the book is concrete evidence, but much of it makes good sense and gives one a much better understanding of the overall history. Other aspects not clearly answered should open other doors to look through for more information..in other words, having better direction on where to look.

Just a bit of info from the book. In a nut shell... If seeking info on Moro arts, look to Silat. FMA, Arnis, and eskrima in general does NOT follow any form of Moro martial art. Any FMA art not falling under Silat that uses Moro clothing and weapons should be questioned. Eskrima is a tried and true Filipino Christian martial art unique to only the Philippines and evolved from fighting with the Moro raiders.

[Rick]

We also remember that when the Spanish first took Manila there was a Moro Datu or Sultan there at the time .

They might have been more than occasional raiders .

[migueldiaz]

Originally Posted by Dimasalang

I guess basically what I am trying to say is, everyone has a preference on how and what they want to learn. Me personally, I wanted to learn a traditional FMA...aside from just pure self defense on the street; I wanted to learn for the cultural heritage part. So obviously, a FMA school that changes with the times by adding this and that and does what every other martial art school is doing; that really is not for me. Hope that all made sense.

Yup, to each his own, and what you said makes a lot of sense. Thanks also for the summary of that book you mentioned.

Originally Posted by Rick

We also remember that when the Spanish first took Manila there was a Moro Datu or Sultan there at the time. They might have been more than occasional raiders .

Hello Rick. Yes, there were several Moro rajahs ruling Manila and environs then, when the Spaniards came during the mid- to late-1500s.

Islam was not as widespread then in northern Philippines (i.e., Luzon), like it was in the southern Phils. then (i.e., Sulu and Mindanao). And central Phils. (i.e., the Visayas) were the least influenced by Islam at that time.

Just to clarify the terms describing Phil. precolonial form of government --

Datu - the head of a barangay (pronounced buh-rung-GUY), which population consisted from just a few families, to several hundred persons; a barangay is run fairly independently vs. other barangays; thus a barangay is the basic political unit, and all of the Philippines' peoples then were organized in this manner.

Raja - a datu who was designated by his peers as the head of an alliance of several barangays; thus Raja Sulaiman was one of the three rajas who ruled precolonial greater Manila then which consisted of many barangays.

Sultan - a sultan is the leader of a much larger geographical area, and there would be rajas and datus under the sultan (like in the sultanates of Sulu and Maguindanao, respectively).

Now on the Moro raids of old, they were done by southern Philippine Moros for two things -- (a) as an act of retribution against the incursion of Spaniards against their homeland (Sulu/Mindanao), and (b) as a means of boosting their rising local economy via the procurement of more manpower.

There were plenty of good and arable land everywhere. Thus conquest of territory did not make sense. It was the people who were the precious "commodities" -- thus, slave raiding was the sensible political and economic move.

As for the 16th century Luzon Moros, they were not engaged in raiding, as there were no Christians then to get irritated at

And perhaps the local population was able to support the Manila economy.

On a related matter, historians also say that the reason Luzon and Visayas fell easily to the colonizers was precisely because of the loose alliance amongst the barangays.

In the case of Sulu and Mindanao however, their higher level of political cohesiveness (via the sultanate) allowed them to resist the colonizers more effectively.

[Rick]

Thanks Miguel for explaining the order of the titles .

[Battara]

I wonder about the silat connection to original Moro systems. I will not deny that there may be some relation, but from what I have seen of silat, it seems to go mostly near the ground. From some old photos of the turn of the centyr and a particular Moro practitioner on Cecil Quirino's Crossing the Sulu Seas, Moro martial arts may not be as low to the ground as silat.

Just my limited observations so far.......

[FilAmfighter1]

Guys,
FMA was been impacted by the constant raiders & settlers from many places. Raiding became an form of commerce. Blades were traded for and many types of blades were used. Yes there are local adaptaion and creations as well. It was so bad that English and thier trade ships were plaged by Moro Pirates. If you want read a excellent book that also refferes to the weapons complete with sketches read the Pirate Wind. You can get it from Austrialan, Hong Kong and England book sellers. The English did great job of documenting their enemies of trade. If you get the chance read the book you get really great feel about the southern Philippines in the 1700- 1800s. It was amazing place and times.

[harimauhk]

Originally Posted by FilAmfighter1

Guys,
FMA was been impacted by the constant raiders & settlers from many places. Raiding became an form of commerce. Blades were traded for and many types of blades were used. Yes there are local adaptaion and creations as well. It was so bad that English and thier trade ships were plaged by Moro Pirates. If you want read a excellent book that also refferes to the weapons complete with sketches read the Pirate Wind. You can get it from Austrialan, Hong Kong and England book sellers. The English did great job of documenting their enemies of trade. If you get the chance read the book you get really great feel about the southern Philippines in the 1700- 1800s. It was amazing place and times.

Sounds good! I'll see if I can find it here--I live in Hong Kong.