an insight into museums and collections

Conogre · 26th May 2005, 04:56 AM

The topics of museum collections, displays, information and preservation have been discussed here in the past, and hopefully, will continue to be discussed in the future as well.
Likewise personal collections, preservation, display, disposition and motivation are also reoccuring topics that change as the membership changes, as does focus between regions and areas of intrest and the propriety of topics open for discussion, all of which I personally feel are of much more importance than many to most members realize.
Over and over, I've seen people who were pointed to this forum for information, often financially motivated, but none-the-less they came and more often than not were both impressed and thankful, almost invariably glad that they took the time.
While it may seem that this is moving away from the original topic, I think it's exactly the opposite, all leading to the fact that antiquities, both distant and recent, are rapidly disappearing and that above all, public interest has to be maintained in order for any change to be affected.
In the few years that I've been a member here, I've learned more than I ever dreamed possible and had my interest piqued each time it lagged, for whatever reason, and hopefully, this and other forums like it will continue to do so in the future, to the point that it may someday lead to museums and the laws pertaining to same being revised in countries around the world.
Since money is the prime motivator, whenever interest can be revived, be it by historically based motion pictures, educational television (which thankfully, seems to be on the increase), Ebay, antique shops, estate sales and of course, museum exhibits and collections all benefit by the sharing of knowledge and the revival of the urge to see and know about such things, particularly when it can be on a personal level.
I'd love to see the Home Shopping Network, for example, start buying and marketing individual collections on nationwide TV if it would lead to more and more pieces falling into the hands of the public where they could be cherished and valued, rather than stashed away in a catacomb somewhere, out of sight and lost, possibly forever.
All things have a finite existance, with articles often lasting longer than the knowledge and culture that surrounded them, from their creation, use (and abuse, where appropriate) and any interest that leads to discovery and preservation of same is bound to benificial to a certain extent, no matter how small.
If enough people descry the "lost collections" of museums, then possibly someday the laws will be changed and the vaults will be opened, viewed as another source of income, while individual collections continue at whatever level is possible, taking the future ahead for at least one more day at a time.Mike

Andrew · 26th May 2005, 05:25 AM

I join in Brian's lament. It may very well be the compulsive acquisitiveness of private collectors that ultimately preserve our martial heritage.

There are woefully few museums I would ever consider gifting my personal collection to.

Even those institutions are really only attractive because of the individuals currently associated with them. People pass through and on, unfortunately.

Ian · 26th May 2005, 06:07 AM

This is a depressing topic but at the same time might present some opportunities. I have wondered whether we as a community of collectors might be part of the solution, especially in the area of conservation.

Part of my "job" as a collector is to maintain my collection in good condition, and even restore some items. I look on this as a responsibility to history and a courtesy to the original culture that produced these magnificent works of style and function. Trial and error are two ways of learning, but I dare say that with a few weeks of "tutoring" by a professional conservator expert in edged weapons, many of us could be pretty darn proficient in this area, at least at the simple stuff. Passionate interest makes for busy hands and careful work.

What is to stop us from being volunteer conservators for some of these institutions? Museums are not likely to let anyone off the street go to work on their collections, but again if we were to undertake a little training, perhaps with a "certificate" at the end, then that might open doors to allow us to be helpful.

Now I did use the word "volunteer." Museums are not likely to pay anyone to do things that are not a priority for them. But free labor is hard to refuse, and I can't imagine the materials necessary to do a lot of this work are going to be very costly -- I'm not talking about repairing gold koftgari, replacing precious stones, or doing delicate restorations. Removing rust, polishing and oiling blades, maintaining leather, etc. are simple and important contributions that we could make.

I'm looking forward to an interesting retirement in about 10 years. This is something I have thought about doing, but don't really know where to start. Perhaps others are already involved and can offer suggestions.

Ian.

Battara · 26th May 2005, 08:28 AM

Interesting idea, Ian. I share your sentiments, although for doing restorations pay would be nice (I like money

). Besides, in the past museums sometimes came to collectors for loaning materials for exibit and still do.

Mark · 26th May 2005, 02:38 PM

I got a cool reaction when I offered to do some volunteer conservation on the SE Asian collection at the Smithsonian. Then again, I had essentially just walked off of the street at that point. Hopefully I can cultivate the relationship to the point where that could happen.

Rick · 26th May 2005, 02:52 PM

Occasional rays of sunlight in the collective gloom .

http://www.oakeshott.org/

B.I · 26th May 2005, 04:06 PM

i agree with andrew, and there is nowhere i would trust with my collection. again, this wasnt a moan about institutions, but a summary of the way things are at the moment.
there is always hope that things will change, and the 'ray of sunshine' rick offered proves that.
its all about generating an interest that goes past the already enthusiastic enthusiast. with our interest comes history and its in this history that the answers may lie in getting the general public on board. the cost of organising new exhibitions are ridiculously high, when you consider the hassle involved in museum loans etc. but, when one happens that concerns arms, you realise the decision to do this must be based on an interest that exists.
the oakshot institute is a great example of how things should be.
unfortunatley, ewan was an institution in himself and thus uncommon but we can all hope that we will all wield such prowess in the academic world one day :-)
also, his passion for his studies was well known, and so it would be hard to stifle his name now. his collection was almost secondary to the legacy he left behind.
i am glad everyone feels the same way. i said it was a hard post to write, for i knew i was in fear of giving ammunition to fire at institutions, which i really wanted to avoid. i should have had more faith :-)

26th May 2005, 02:52 PM	#6
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,339	Then There Are Occasional rays of sunlight in the collective gloom . http://www.oakeshott.org/

26th May 2005, 04:56 AM	#1
Conogre Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 371	The topics of museum collections, displays, information and preservation have been discussed here in the past, and hopefully, will continue to be discussed in the future as well. Likewise personal collections, preservation, display, disposition and motivation are also reoccuring topics that change as the membership changes, as does focus between regions and areas of intrest and the propriety of topics open for discussion, all of which I personally feel are of much more importance than many to most members realize. Over and over, I've seen people who were pointed to this forum for information, often financially motivated, but none-the-less they came and more often than not were both impressed and thankful, almost invariably glad that they took the time. While it may seem that this is moving away from the original topic, I think it's exactly the opposite, all leading to the fact that antiquities, both distant and recent, are rapidly disappearing and that above all, public interest has to be maintained in order for any change to be affected. In the few years that I've been a member here, I've learned more than I ever dreamed possible and had my interest piqued each time it lagged, for whatever reason, and hopefully, this and other forums like it will continue to do so in the future, to the point that it may someday lead to museums and the laws pertaining to same being revised in countries around the world. Since money is the prime motivator, whenever interest can be revived, be it by historically based motion pictures, educational television (which thankfully, seems to be on the increase), Ebay, antique shops, estate sales and of course, museum exhibits and collections all benefit by the sharing of knowledge and the revival of the urge to see and know about such things, particularly when it can be on a personal level. I'd love to see the Home Shopping Network, for example, start buying and marketing individual collections on nationwide TV if it would lead to more and more pieces falling into the hands of the public where they could be cherished and valued, rather than stashed away in a catacomb somewhere, out of sight and lost, possibly forever. All things have a finite existance, with articles often lasting longer than the knowledge and culture that surrounded them, from their creation, use (and abuse, where appropriate) and any interest that leads to discovery and preservation of same is bound to benificial to a certain extent, no matter how small. If enough people descry the "lost collections" of museums, then possibly someday the laws will be changed and the vaults will be opened, viewed as another source of income, while individual collections continue at whatever level is possible, taking the future ahead for at least one more day at a time.Mike

26th May 2005, 05:25 AM	#2
Andrew Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: USA Posts: 1,725	I join in Brian's lament. It may very well be the compulsive acquisitiveness of private collectors that ultimately preserve our martial heritage. There are woefully few museums I would ever consider gifting my personal collection to. Even those institutions are really only attractive because of the individuals currently associated with them. People pass through and on, unfortunately.

26th May 2005, 06:07 AM	#3
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,397	This is a depressing topic but at the same time might present some opportunities. I have wondered whether we as a community of collectors might be part of the solution, especially in the area of conservation. Part of my "job" as a collector is to maintain my collection in good condition, and even restore some items. I look on this as a responsibility to history and a courtesy to the original culture that produced these magnificent works of style and function. Trial and error are two ways of learning, but I dare say that with a few weeks of "tutoring" by a professional conservator expert in edged weapons, many of us could be pretty darn proficient in this area, at least at the simple stuff. Passionate interest makes for busy hands and careful work. What is to stop us from being volunteer conservators for some of these institutions? Museums are not likely to let anyone off the street go to work on their collections, but again if we were to undertake a little training, perhaps with a "certificate" at the end, then that might open doors to allow us to be helpful. Now I did use the word "volunteer." Museums are not likely to pay anyone to do things that are not a priority for them. But free labor is hard to refuse, and I can't imagine the materials necessary to do a lot of this work are going to be very costly -- I'm not talking about repairing gold koftgari, replacing precious stones, or doing delicate restorations. Removing rust, polishing and oiling blades, maintaining leather, etc. are simple and important contributions that we could make. I'm looking forward to an interesting retirement in about 10 years. This is something I have thought about doing, but don't really know where to start. Perhaps others are already involved and can offer suggestions. Ian.

26th May 2005, 08:28 AM	#4
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,280	Interesting idea, Ian. I share your sentiments, although for doing restorations pay would be nice (I like money ). Besides, in the past museums sometimes came to collectors for loaning materials for exibit and still do.

26th May 2005, 02:38 PM	#5
Mark Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 987	I got a cool reaction when I offered to do some volunteer conservation on the SE Asian collection at the Smithsonian. Then again, I had essentially just walked off of the street at that point. Hopefully I can cultivate the relationship to the point where that could happen.

26th May 2005, 04:06 PM	#7
B.I Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 485	i agree with andrew, and there is nowhere i would trust with my collection. again, this wasnt a moan about institutions, but a summary of the way things are at the moment. there is always hope that things will change, and the 'ray of sunshine' rick offered proves that. its all about generating an interest that goes past the already enthusiastic enthusiast. with our interest comes history and its in this history that the answers may lie in getting the general public on board. the cost of organising new exhibitions are ridiculously high, when you consider the hassle involved in museum loans etc. but, when one happens that concerns arms, you realise the decision to do this must be based on an interest that exists. the oakshot institute is a great example of how things should be. unfortunatley, ewan was an institution in himself and thus uncommon but we can all hope that we will all wield such prowess in the academic world one day :-) also, his passion for his studies was well known, and so it would be hard to stifle his name now. his collection was almost secondary to the legacy he left behind. i am glad everyone feels the same way. i said it was a hard post to write, for i knew i was in fear of giving ammunition to fire at institutions, which i really wanted to avoid. i should have had more faith :-)