one more keris

[A. G. Maisey]

Brekele, from your posts I have formed the opinion that you are very familiar with the Madurese language and with Madurese keris related terminology .

You have told us that the name used in Madura for the type of warangka shown here is either deng udengan or urang urangan.

I have noted that over the last 10 or 15 years names and attributes used by some sellers of principally Madurese keris have varied from names and attributes that I became acquainted with in the years between 1985 and 1995, when I visited both Sumenep and Pamekesan on a number of occasions

For instance, at that time, the capu kagok form of ladrangan warangka was acknowledged as a legitimate Madurese form, shared with Surakarta, however, now I find that some people wish to place this form in East Jawa, and call it an East Javanese Ladrangan.

The Sumenep Ladrangan form was referred to as a Ladrangan back prior to 1995, however, I now find that some people want to call it Daunan --- in other words, a warangka with a "daun", referring to the wide leaf shaped projection of a ladrangan warangka.

During my visits to Sumenep I visited the Karaton musium on a number of occasions. In that musium there were examples of various types of warangkas attributable to Sumenep. Two of those warangkas were identified as "gabilan", and "brahmana rsi". These warangka types were the only types on display with heavily carved atasans, and the most easily recognisable difference between them was that the brahmana rsi form was a little larger than the gabilan form.

Before reading your recent posts, I would have been inclined to identify the warangkas shown in posts 1, 7, 18, and 19 as gabilan, and the warangka shown in post 5 as sandang walikat.

Now, my question to you is this:-

can you please explain the difference between the warangkas that you have identified as either deng udengan or urang urangan, and the warangkas of the forms gabilan and brahmana rsi

or perhaps what we are looking at is a language level variation?

a variation where in lower level language "deng udengan" is used, and in the language of the court uses "gabilan" ?

As your knowledge of the Madurese language is clearly far in advance of my own, and I assume most other people here, I would greatly appreciate it if could clarify this matter for us.

Thank you.

[brekele]

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

or perhaps what we are looking at is a language level variation?

a variation where in lower level language "deng udengan" is used, and in the language of the court uses "gabilan" ?

Dear Alan .
Gabilan is actually word that maduranese call it for keris Gayaman’s style..
So, Javanese called gayaman and maduranese say Gabilan.
If you bring javanene keris with gayaman style and show it to old maduranese people…they will say your keris warangka’s style is “Gabilan Jawa”, but young maduranese will say “Gayaman Jawa”. IMHO, I think this is because now many young Maduranese learn keris from books which is influenced a lot by Javanese Keris writer.
But javanenese keris (gayaman style) compare gayaman style of maduranese keris is only a bit different looks. Maduranese Gabilan, sampir part is a bit bigger, somehow it seems not match looking between gandar size and sampir size.

Warangka “Kongbukongan” is a warangka that syimbolize from burung betet ( parrot bird ).
There is also “Canmacanan” style. It’s a style of warangka with tiger’s wood carved.
But finally I have no pictures now for both of warangka, I’ll post it maybe tomorrow.

[brekele]

Here I try to attach 3 pictures of different style of maduranese warangka.

First warangka’s style is called ladrangan Nongko , because sampir shape was taken from daun pohon nangka’s shape (Jackfruit’s leaf).

Second warangka’s style is called ladrangan sukun , taken from daun sukun’s shape (Artocarpus communis leaf).

3th, Warangka’s style is called “Lanbulanan”, taken from shape of bulan sabit (Half moon).

First and second pictures, shown Janggelan hilt.

Janggelan is taken from the shape of “Ampas buah Jagung” (inside of corn fruit that has been take out all of the corn’s seed), oh…sorry for my English for the last explanation about “Corn”, because difficult word for "Ampas Jagung" to find in English dictionary.

[Rick]

I think the english word you are looking for is ' cob ' Brekele .

[brekele]

Yes Rick, your are 100% right.
Janggelan hilt shape is taken from "Cob".
Thank you Rick.

[A. G. Maisey]

Thank you very much for your prompt and informative response, Brekele.

So, we can take "gabilan" as the Madurese equivalent for "gayaman".

However, this raises for me the question as to why prior to 1995, my enquiries in Sumenep and Pamekesan indicated that the Javanese wrongkos that I know as gayaman were also identified by Madurese people as gayaman, but the heavily carved form such as was on display in the kraton musium was identified as gabilan. This was between 15 and 25 years ago, and at that time, most of the people I spoke with were not young men, but people of around my own age, or perhaps a little older, similarly, 15-25 years ago the plethora of keris books that have now flooded the market, did not exist.

In my previous post I mentioned the brahmana rsi form.

Do you know this form?


Moving to the ladrangan form.

You have shown two forms of ladrangan wrongko, each with a further classificatory name. This seems to indicate that the classification of "ladrangan" is still alive and well in Madura, and if this is so, then why do we now so often see these Madura ladrangans described as "daunan"?

The ladrangan from timoho, that you identify as ladrangan sukun was identified by several informants in Madura, pre-1995, as capu kagok. Incidentally, has the daun on this warangka been shortened because of repair? Proportion is is not good. Or is this a photographic distortion?


Rick, "ampas jagung" is actually more than just "corn cob". "Ampas" means waste or residue after all the good stuff has been removed, jagung is the corn, so ampas jagung is the corn cob that has been stripped of its seed.

[Rick]

Thank you Alan, that was what I thought .

[brekele]

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

So, we can take "gabilan" as the Madurese equivalent for "gayaman".

Of course diffrent area diffrent way to say it but IMO, I would personally think so, just please correct me if my thought was wrong, Javanese Culture influenced to Maduranese for this gayaman subject.

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

In my previous post I mentioned the brahmana rsi form.

Do you know this form?

I never heard & know about this kind of warangka , first time heard it from you

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

why do we now so often see these Madura ladrangans described as "daunan"?

Among young maduranese (my age) friend of mine, some of them said “Daunan” for warangka with shape of jackfruit’ leaf and “Ladrang daun” or “ Ladrang daunan” for warangka with shape of Sukun’s leaf.
Again, influenced of Javanese Culture is very strong in their heart & mind because they born or grow up in Jawa (Surabaya) even they has Maduranese blood. So, I got most of Keris Madura’s knowledge from young Maduranese friends.

But for older people I heard they said “Daunan” for both of warangka style. Well, I dont have many older Maduranese friends.

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

has the daun on this warangka been shortened because of repair?

No, It is originally and no repair.

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by brekele

Here I try to attach 3 pictures of different style of maduranese warangka.

First warangka’s style is called ladrangan Nongko , because sampir shape was taken from daun pohon nangka’s shape (Jackfruit’s leaf).

Thank you Brekele, all is very informative. And I think now is also clear from where the name daunan orginate from.

Detlef