Ancient, armed Indian from Kabul

Ian · 23rd May 2005, 06:11 AM

A couple of years ago I visited the Royal Palace at Mysore and its adjacent museum. Within the museum's display of arms were a half dozen Burmese dha from the first half of the 19th C. They were gifts to the Maharajah of Mysore from a Burmese delegation. This was not surprising perhaps because the British had already gone through the First Burmese War and opened up trade to some degree with Burma.

The dha that was the original subject of this discussion in the picture of an "Afghan" is not a typical Burmese design, but rather a long handled version more closely associated with Thailand, probably a cavalry sword.

Here is a picture of a similar styled darb from my collection. The hilt and scabbard are covered with silver.

In the early 19th C. Thailand was also reticent to open its borders to trade with Europe. There were some Thai delegations sent to W. Europe around this time, especially to France as the French were planning to enter Indo-China as an attempt to balance the British influence in the region.

Much harder to explain a Thai sword on an "Afghan" than a Burmese one.

Ian.

Aqtai · 23rd May 2005, 08:29 AM

B.I.

I have just dug up that V&A postcard to see what it says on the back. The caption is Lahore, first half of 19th century... Courtesy of the board of Trustees of the Armouries.

That year there was an exhibition of Sikh Art, and it may be that the armour was loaned for that reason. I'm surprised though, the V&A already has a very good collection of Islamic and Oriental armour, you wouldn't have thought they needed a loan from the Royal Armouries.

I have seen other pictures as well as real examples in museums of Ganga-Jamni mail, and I know that they do other patterns, including Arabic writing.

This particular picture comes, from of all places, a Dorling Kindersley book

.

The same book has another picture of mail identical to the one in the original picture in this thread.

tom hyle · 23rd May 2005, 12:29 PM

One thing worth noting about the royal armouries dagger is that they are/were clearly aware of the resemblance to a SE Asian piece, and considered that worth mentioning; it could be an error, but is not a simple mistake of ignorance of forms. it is possible dhas were known to the curators, but the yaganesque blade threw them off, for instance. Perhaps they "knew" that this shape of blade came from Alexander/Macedon....

23rd May 2005, 06:11 AM	#1
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,399	Dha in Royal Museum, Mysore A couple of years ago I visited the Royal Palace at Mysore and its adjacent museum. Within the museum's display of arms were a half dozen Burmese dha from the first half of the 19th C. They were gifts to the Maharajah of Mysore from a Burmese delegation. This was not surprising perhaps because the British had already gone through the First Burmese War and opened up trade to some degree with Burma. The dha that was the original subject of this discussion in the picture of an "Afghan" is not a typical Burmese design, but rather a long handled version more closely associated with Thailand, probably a cavalry sword. Here is a picture of a similar styled darb from my collection. The hilt and scabbard are covered with silver. In the early 19th C. Thailand was also reticent to open its borders to trade with Europe. There were some Thai delegations sent to W. Europe around this time, especially to France as the French were planning to enter Indo-China as an attempt to balance the British influence in the region. Much harder to explain a Thai sword on an "Afghan" than a Burmese one. Ian.

23rd May 2005, 08:29 AM	#2
Aqtai Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Merseyside, UK Posts: 222	B.I. I have just dug up that V&A postcard to see what it says on the back. The caption is Lahore, first half of 19th century... Courtesy of the board of Trustees of the Armouries. That year there was an exhibition of Sikh Art, and it may be that the armour was loaned for that reason. I'm surprised though, the V&A already has a very good collection of Islamic and Oriental armour, you wouldn't have thought they needed a loan from the Royal Armouries. I have seen other pictures as well as real examples in museums of Ganga-Jamni mail, and I know that they do other patterns, including Arabic writing. This particular picture comes, from of all places, a Dorling Kindersley book . The same book has another picture of mail identical to the one in the original picture in this thread. Last edited by Aqtai; 23rd May 2005 at 09:00 AM.

23rd May 2005, 12:29 PM	#3
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	One thing worth noting about the royal armouries dagger is that they are/were clearly aware of the resemblance to a SE Asian piece, and considered that worth mentioning; it could be an error, but is not a simple mistake of ignorance of forms. it is possible dhas were known to the curators, but the yaganesque blade threw them off, for instance. Perhaps they "knew" that this shape of blade came from Alexander/Macedon....