Seven Palm Musket

fernando · 6th December 2009, 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Fernando, I'm confused .

Is a Palm the distance across the hand from thumb base to heel of hand ; or lengthwise, base of palm to longest fingertip ?

Across the hand, fully stretched, from thumb tip to small finger tip. If you have a 'standard' hand, measure it this way and you will have an approximate result.
I used to play buttons when i was a kid, and we still used Palms. You toss your button against the wall and if it falls within a palm from your foe's button, you score. I was not such a winner, as i had a small hand

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Fernando

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fernando · 7th December 2009, 12:04 AM

Like so

.

Rick · 7th December 2009, 02:16 PM

Ahhh, thank you Fernando !

We used to play that game with pennies .

broadaxe · 7th December 2009, 05:06 PM

That palm is called shibr or shiber in Arabic and modern Hebrew, hence the term shibriyah which stands for the traditional dagger of the bedouins. According the arab folklore it indicates the lenght of the blade.

Queequeg · 8th December 2009, 08:57 PM

Thanks for the answers, gents. I appreciate having learned about this.

katana · 10th December 2009, 01:50 PM

Hi Fernando,
in Britain, the measurement you show(in your photo) would be a called a 'span' ......a 'palm' is equal to the width of 4 fingers...3 inches or so.

Regards David

Matchlock · 10th December 2009, 02:55 PM

Hi there,

I found these line drawings on entering palm measure at google.

It his, as has been suggested, most probably a length measure taken from a part of the human body. My palm, e.g., measures 9 cm in width.

As Willocks' The Religion is settled in 1565, the mentioning of seven-palm and nine-palm muskets should, in my opinion, refer to the overall length of the guns. Let me just point out as an aside that, as I have mentioned previously, the term musket seems to have arisen in mid-16th century. Most of the guns of that period which we have come to call (h)arquebuses nowadays had an average overall length of ca. 70-90 cm. A significant terminological difference between the shorter and the longer guns did not exist yet.

So, as a conclusion, the idea is quite convincing to me that seven to nine palm guns - no matter whether they were called arquebuses or muskets - would have been about 80 cm long.

Best wishes,
Michael

7th December 2009, 12:04 AM	#2
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Like so . Attached Images

10th December 2009, 02:55 PM	#7
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Hi there, I found these line drawings on entering palm measure at google. It his, as has been suggested, most probably a length measure taken from a part of the human body. My palm, e.g., measures 9 cm in width. As Willocks' The Religion is settled in 1565, the mentioning of seven-palm and nine-palm muskets should, in my opinion, refer to the overall length of the guns. Let me just point out as an aside that, as I have mentioned previously, the term musket seems to have arisen in mid-16th century. Most of the guns of that period which we have come to call (h)arquebuses nowadays had an average overall length of ca. 70-90 cm. A significant terminological difference between the shorter and the longer guns did not exist yet. So, as a conclusion, the idea is quite convincing to me that seven to nine palm guns - no matter whether they were called arquebuses or muskets - would have been about 80 cm long. Best wishes, Michael Attached Images

7th December 2009, 02:16 PM	#3
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,365	Ahhh, thank you Fernando ! We used to play that game with pennies .

7th December 2009, 05:06 PM	#4
broadaxe Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 334	That palm is called shibr or shiber in Arabic and modern Hebrew, hence the term shibriyah which stands for the traditional dagger of the bedouins. According the arab folklore it indicates the lenght of the blade.

8th December 2009, 08:57 PM	#5
Queequeg Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Detroit (New Mayapan) Posts: 96	Thanks for the answers, gents. I appreciate having learned about this.

10th December 2009, 01:50 PM	#6
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	Hi Fernando, in Britain, the measurement you show(in your photo) would be a called a 'span' ......a 'palm' is equal to the width of 4 fingers...3 inches or so. Regards David