Thai daab/katana fusion

Jim McDougall · 20th August 2009, 06:48 PM

Beautiful example! and fascinating topic Mark.
I have often wondered how closely the swords of Asia cross influenced, and this is a great illustration. The blade does resemble the willow leaf, and it seems that at certain times there were great numbers of Japanese swords brought into China, which brought, among other features, the discoid guard.

Those wavy lines seem to be an often seen motif on SE Asian swords. Is there any specific symbolism?

All best regards,
Jim

Battara · 21st August 2009, 01:38 AM

I agree - fascinating and lovely. I love the metal work on the handle.

DhaDha · 21st August 2009, 07:02 AM

Really, really nice. Really.

wilked aka Khun Deng · 21st August 2009, 07:49 AM

As Mark mentions there was quite the Japanese influence in Thailand. Should you get the chance check out the Grand Palace in Bangkok as you enter there is another section that will cost you few extra baht to enter, but well worth the investment. It house much of the Royal jewelry, arms and insignia. It was there through and interview with a guard that I learned about the different royal ranks and who could what (enamel, copper, silver, gold, jewels) on their accouterments. Apparently there were court rules that governed all of this - never did find a copy.

But you've got to stop by the armory - dha galore - and surprisingly keris also. But the one part that stuck in mind and has to do with what Mark is talking about here was a small sign near, what I thought was, a katana. Mentioned that in 1660 (I think) a Japanese merchant was elevated to the rank of Chao Praya (or one those ranks), the highest achieved by any foreigner after he raised 3000 troops (from within Thailand) to fight for the king in one of the wars.

That along with the fact that the Japanese used to trade blades for Thai rayskin, the Prince's sword is a Thai katana and I'm thinking that qualifies as significant Japanese influence

wilked aka Khun Deng · 21st August 2009, 07:50 AM

BTW Mark I've only seen these in a museum and the one you have - keep a watchful eye on that one my brother.

Nathaniel · 21st August 2009, 02:37 PM

Stunning piece Mark! Thanks for sharing...I think many are drooling...I know I am...I especially like the imitation of the cord wrap on the handle...and the seal on the end!

Here are some pictures of some Thai -Japanese hybrids Puff posted a while back:

sirupate · 21st August 2009, 05:58 PM

I wonder if one of the main influences for this style of sword in Siam/Thailand, didn't stem from when Yamada Nagamasa with 800 ronin helped bring order back into Thailand after the death of King Song Thom in 1628, very nice sword btw.

Mark · 21st August 2009, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilked aka Khun Deng

It was there through and interview with a guard that I learned about the different royal ranks and who could what (enamel, copper, silver, gold, jewels) on their accouterments. Apparently there were court rules that governed all of this - never did find a copy.

Did you learn any specifics about the number of bands on the scabbard? As I recall that reflected rank as well. I could never find more than passing reference to it, though.

21st August 2009, 07:49 AM	#4
wilked aka Khun Deng Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Oahu, Hawaii Posts: 166	Grand Palace As Mark mentions there was quite the Japanese influence in Thailand. Should you get the chance check out the Grand Palace in Bangkok as you enter there is another section that will cost you few extra baht to enter, but well worth the investment. It house much of the Royal jewelry, arms and insignia. It was there through and interview with a guard that I learned about the different royal ranks and who could what (enamel, copper, silver, gold, jewels) on their accouterments. Apparently there were court rules that governed all of this - never did find a copy. But you've got to stop by the armory - dha galore - and surprisingly keris also. But the one part that stuck in mind and has to do with what Mark is talking about here was a small sign near, what I thought was, a katana. Mentioned that in 1660 (I think) a Japanese merchant was elevated to the rank of Chao Praya (or one those ranks), the highest achieved by any foreigner after he raised 3000 troops (from within Thailand) to fight for the king in one of the wars. That along with the fact that the Japanese used to trade blades for Thai rayskin, the Prince's sword is a Thai katana and I'm thinking that qualifies as significant Japanese influence

21st August 2009, 07:50 AM	#5
wilked aka Khun Deng Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Oahu, Hawaii Posts: 166	BTW BTW Mark I've only seen these in a museum and the one you have - keep a watchful eye on that one my brother.

20th August 2009, 06:48 PM	#1
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,284	Beautiful example! and fascinating topic Mark. I have often wondered how closely the swords of Asia cross influenced, and this is a great illustration. The blade does resemble the willow leaf, and it seems that at certain times there were great numbers of Japanese swords brought into China, which brought, among other features, the discoid guard. Those wavy lines seem to be an often seen motif on SE Asian swords. Is there any specific symbolism? All best regards, Jim

21st August 2009, 01:38 AM	#2
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,280	I agree - fascinating and lovely. I love the metal work on the handle.

21st August 2009, 07:02 AM	#3
DhaDha Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 178	Really, really nice. Really.

21st August 2009, 02:37 PM	#6
Nathaniel Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 865	Stunning piece Mark! Thanks for sharing...I think many are drooling...I know I am...I especially like the imitation of the cord wrap on the handle...and the seal on the end! Here are some pictures of some Thai -Japanese hybrids Puff posted a while back:

21st August 2009, 05:58 PM	#7
sirupate Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: England Posts: 373	I wonder if one of the main influences for this style of sword in Siam/Thailand, didn't stem from when Yamada Nagamasa with 800 ronin helped bring order back into Thailand after the death of King Song Thom in 1628, very nice sword btw.