Manual del Baratero - A Review

[Chris Evans]

Hi,

Tom,

Fair comment - You draw attention to something that should be a mandatory recitation by all students of martial arts, be it Eastern or Western; Namely, that even the most seemingly devastating attack may not be instantly disabling, giving ample opportunity to the opponent to counter-strike. In the long history of dueling, there have been numerous examples of someone scoring a hit, thinking that the fight was over, only to receive an unexpected counter hit with grievous consequences.

Knives lacking a reach advantage bring both parties extremely close and expose the wielder to counter hits far more than swords do; This has to be kept in mind when choosing tactics.

Another point (no pun intended) is that the PS is infrequently performed with modern fencing swords, because they move too fast, yet it is worth remembering that knives are faster again, able to change direction even more quickly.


Frank,

Many of the 6"-9" bladed navajas that had a lock were capable weapons, but only once they were opened. Most were slow and clumsy in this respect, but there were a few notable exceptions. I have an old 10" bladed navaja, made in the French manner with a "teat" lock (as still found on Italian stilettos) the massive blade of which can be flung open like any modern tactical folder (see picture). It is very weak at the hinge but it can be deployed mighty fast - A shorter bladed version would have been rather formidable. Of course, for this very reason, it would have been banned in most Spanish jurisdictions, much in the manner that automatic switchblades tend to attract the full wrath of the law in modern times.

Much more research is needed before we can say with certainty just how common was the violent usage of navajas. There is some rather compelling evidence in Forton's works that a most attacks were committed with weapons other than navajas. Another factor to keep in mind is that in the old days, lacking forensic capabilities, the authorities could not easily disprove a confession in which the guilty party admitted to having carved up someone with a navaja (more or less legal) as opposed to the real weapon used having been a dagger or knife (highly illegal), rapidly drawn from concealment.

Personally, after having examined quite a number of antiques, I am of the opinion that actual fighting with navajas must have been far less frequent than alleged these days and when it did occur, it was in ritualized dueling that seldom went the distance and during which only easily parried sweeping cuts were being traded (most navajas did not have a lock and this made the more lethal thrust very risky).

Cheers
Chris

[Frank]

Chris,

In Fortons Navaja Antigua page 258 there is a navaja described as VIROLA GIRATORIA. My Spanish helper has not been able to translatte this for me. Does not seem to have a lock of any kind. What is this navaja.

Why has this book not ben translated? I find it very frustrating and hard to understand. Such a good book full of info and nobody has bothered with it. Cant believe it.

Best Wishes
Frank

[Chris Evans]

Hi Frank,

1. "Virola Giratoria" means a navaja fitted with a rotating bolster lock. The Spaniards in their search for a locking mechanism tried various solutions to the problem and this was one of them.

It consisted of a sheet-metal ferrule that rotated atop the bolster blocking the closure of the blade. It was easy to make and very secure, but was rather slow to open and tended to fall apart. Modern knives that use this type of lock are the French Opinel and the US Cold Steel Twistmaster.

You can see both these knives here:

http://www.physics.mun.ca/~sstamp/kn...nel_large.html


2. Re Translation of Forton's Works: To date, as far as the English speaking world is concerned, there has been little serious interest in the navaja. The recent spate of interest seems to have came mainly from martial artists - Serious collectors and historians of edged weapons do not appear to be all that interested and in any event, such potential readers are not numerous. Maybe a market survey would contradict this, but even such surveys cost a lot.

A translation of La Navaja Espanola Antigua with its 490 pages, would be a huge task, requiring at least a year's full time work. You can chalk that up as at least $US60,000 and then there are also the publishing costs. To invest that kind of time and money, one would have to be sure of selling a lot of copies.

Perhaps a much more abridged work would have a better chance, but by necessity it would have to be a superficial coverage of the subject.

So, don't hold your breath waiting for a translation.

Cheers
Chris

[Frank]

Chris

Thanks for those answers.

So you don't think we'll ever get a translation of Forton. Thats a pity. Any other Spanish works worth translating?

I also noticed that in theMejores Piezas de Colecsion there are many navajas of other nationalities including India. Any coments?

Best Wishes
Frank

[Chris Evans]

Hi Frank,

1. It is not possible to write seriously on the navaja without drawing heavily on the work of Forton. As far as I am aware, there is only one other work worth considering, that of Arturo Sanchez De Vivar, titled La Navaja Clasica. It is a simple and concise work that also drew heavily on Forton and it was written to address mainly the needs of collectors. At least in Spanish, I consider it overshadowed by Forton's Las Mejores Piezas de Colecsion. May be worth translating, but with the same effort a more comprehensive book could be written. However even such a modest work would be a financial risk in terms of publishing costs, especially that of photography which would require going to Spain and hiring a local photographer.

2. The Spaniards claim that they invented the navaja and others copied its design. This may or may not be true, but remarkably similar clasp knives were in use in other parts of Europe, mostly in France and Italy and generally of significantly better quality.

Here is a superb Italian navaja:

http://www.knivescollection.com/cata...d_coltello=631

It was probably an early 19th century exhibition piece, with a 44cm (17") blade that was provided with a sheath, presumably so that it could be carried in the open position if the owner so desired and if the jurisdiction's law permitted it though the long handle would have made this very uncomfortable.

I strongly suspect that the Spaniards were not the only ones to have legislated against fixed blade knives, for why else would the Italians and the French, just to mention two , bothered with inferior (to a fixed blade) folders? That these nations also passed restrictive legislation of some sorts is evidenced by the old and curious practice of selling navajas with the blade's tip sporting a blunt appendage which the owner ground off to end up with the desired sharp point; This was done to circumvent the prohibition of selling pointed clasp knives. The attached phot is that of such an Italian navaja that never saw use and was sold some time ago by the internet firm (knivescollection) given above.

It is my opinion that to make a truly comprehensive study of the navaja one would have to broaden the scope of inquiry so as to include other European nations, besides Spain; However, linguistically this would require an unusually gifted researcher who is capable of looking through old police records and similar archival documents written in a number of different languages. This is why we cannot find anything worth reading in English on European knives and their usage.

As you rightly mention, there were navajas made even as afar as India, though that was around 1900. The basic design lending itself to being manufactured in low tech workshops.

Cheers
Chris

[Frank]

Chris,

I am thinking of getting a real navaja. I am tosing up between a replica or a real antique. Which do you reccomend wrom which dealer. The prices seem fairly much the same.

Best wishes
Frank

[Chris Evans]

Hi Frank,

It all depends on what you want it for. If you have actual usage in mind, that would impart wear and tear, then the only sensible option is to get a repro. On the other hand, if you wish to study the attributes of period pieces, then an antique is mandatory.

You are right, prices are much the same, with few exceptions. The most difficult decision is to choose the type that you want. Spanish made, in the southern style, or French, maybe even Italian; Then, late 18th century or mid or late 19th.

The bulk of the affordable repros, these days indiscriminately intermix early and late features and use stainless steel for the blades and springs - You have to be rather choosy whose products you buy.

If you want a working navaja, then it is hard to go past Exposito's, although these are entirely utilitarian and quite unlike the earlier ones that doubled up as weapons.

You have my address, so once you have decided on something, drop me aline and I'll tell you what I think. There are a lot of good antiques that turn up on e-bay, at reasonable prices. If you go to a dealer, expect to pay 50% more.

Cheers
Chris

[dennee]

Terrific and informative thread!

The slowness of opening and common lack of lock would certainly seem to make the navaja inferior for some purposes. But they also made them acceptable to carry. For an attacker, the slowness of the opening is less of a problem than to a defender. And, as was mentioned above, lack of a lock probably dictated more slashing.

Consider a common weapon in American slums at the end of the nineteenth century--the straight razor. Portable, concealable, useful for other purposes, not inherently illegal, no lock, no thrusting capability, but a quicker open.

[Chris Evans]

Hi dennee,

You are absolutely right about locks, or rather their absence on the great majority of navajas.

The straight razor was in its heyday a much favoured weapon with all kinds of people all over the word, though I suspect that its power to intimidate far exceeded its potential as a weapon. Some years ago, I remember seeing a Brazilian film, the name of which now escapes me. Actually, it was more like a musical and set in the 1940s, in which a corrupt police officer fights a ritualized duel with razors with a slum hustler with whom he was in a racket and later fell out. They used Caoperia techniques and the name of the game was to "mark" the face of the opponent . The fight choreography wasn't terribly convincing, but it gave us some idea. And by the way, the cop lost and had a neat set of little vertical scars to show for his troubles, all adroitely planted there by his opponent.

Cheers
Chris

[Robert Gray]

Chris

You mentioned "Capoeria". Now isn't that a proper system of fighting, like
say the FMA and do they use knives and other weapons in Capoeria? Was this
art present in other SA countries and did it influence gaucho knife fighting?

Regards
Robert