War Shillelagh

[Lew]

Yes clubs are quite effective and a heavy well made one can break and crush bones even if you get hit in the arms,legs or any part of the torso the are not just head bangers as many people think. Clubs come in all shapes and sizes and are really fun to collect they are one of my favorite weapons. Here is one that was used for personal protection by an American geologist during the 1920s-30s in Rhodesia while mining for copper.


Lew

[Jim McDougall]

Lew, you always come up with really neat weapons!!! and it seems with intriguing provenance that adds great dimension. Great visuals thinking of what must have been high adventure in those days.

Just though of another discussion not too long ago about the well known police truncheons or 'billy clubs'.

Best regards,
Jim

[RomaRana]

Just a side note. The real Monk was actually named Monk Eastman. He was a turn of the century (1900) Jewish gang leader on the Lower East Side.

[David]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monk_Eastman

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by RomaRana

Just a side note. The real Monk was actually named Monk Eastman. He was a turn of the century (1900) Jewish gang leader on the Lower East Side.

Now THAT'S interesting!! and wonder if he got the idea of notching the club from the dime novel boys writing on gunfighters, or if the idea was his own form of psychological warfare.
Along these lines comes to mind Buford Pusser, the southern sheriff in "Walking Tall".

Best regards,
Jim

[RomaRana]

I don't have my books with me and I might be slightly off on the details, but the story behind Monk's notches was that he was a Sherriff (bouncer) in a wild bar in his younger days. Every time he whacked somebody and threw them out of the bar he put a notch on his club.

When he reached 39 marks he clubbed a random person to make it an even 40.

edit to add,

Just looked at the wiki link it was for a even fifty.

[Gavin Nugent]

Nice subject guys and with great historical relevance.

I'd like to offer a few points from my experience thus far.

Originally Posted by Queequeg

It also looks like he had the end painted, perhaps with tar or pitch. Dipping the head in hot tar would certainly seal any cracks and enhance its durability.

So, has anyone here ever seen or heard of a shillelagh that big? Or is this just strictly the idea of the movie prop makers?

With comparison to the images below that I have supplied from my small collection of walking sticks and with Monk being a true Irish man I would in the first instance think that his Shillelagh would be made from Irish Black thorn.

This is some text I have gathered from other sources;

Irish Blackthorn;

"These time-honoured, one-piece Blackthorn Shillelaghs are selected and cut from dense thickets sourced from the forests of Ireland.

Blackthorn: Prunus spinosa, is a relative of cherries and plums. Sloe, the blue-black fruits are edible, but bitter until after the first frost. The name for the blackthorn in Ogham, a language used by the Druids, is straif, the origin of the word "strife" and is about Conflict."

As seen in my images below, the bark is also present on the root ball head in places. Looking at the initial images supplied of Monk by Queequeg, I too can see bark present on the root ball head. I would say that he is using a very large piece of blackthorn root-ball and trunk and the handle where the notches are, has been stripped of bark and is consistent with the colour presented on mine where time and use has worn away the bark. The full consistent colour of the head of Monk's is due to lacquer that is also present on some parts of mine.

As mine is a daily user along side the hounds when I walk them, I know a single blow from one of these could drop a man for good and I have tested it on inanamate objects with devistating effect, so it is no surprise that Monk had 50 notches on his.

The one I have pictured is approx 100 years old.

Gav

[Jim McDougall]

Thats some intriguing history Gav, I didnt know that about the term for the wood used and its association with the use of the shillelagh.
All this talk about these has just reminded me that my wife is intensely of Irish ancestry.....oh oh!!

All the best,
Jim

[David]

Originally Posted by freebooter

With comparison to the images below that I have supplied from my small collection of walking sticks and with Monk being a true Irish man I would in the first instance think that his Shillelagh would be made from Irish Black thorn.

Ah, but was Monk really a "true Irish man"? It does seem fairly obvious that his character was based on Monk Eastman (Osterman), a Jew from Brooklyn who often used the name Delaney, probably to earn himself creds with other Irish gang members. So possibly the movie character Monk McGinn is just playing at being Irish.
Also if the shillelagh was made in the States it seems far more likely that it wood be made of local wood instead of imported Irish Black Thorn. As for the movie prop itself i haven't a clue, though i am not so sure that they would have gone out of their way to create a prop specifically made of Black Thorn since very, very few viewers would give it a second thought.

[Lew]

Originally Posted by RomaRana

I don't have my books with me and I might be slightly off on the details, but the story behind Monk's notches was that he was a Sherriff (bouncer) in a wild bar in his younger days. Every time he whacked somebody and threw them out of the bar he put a notch on his club.

When he reached 39 marks he clubbed a random person to make it an even 40.

edit to add,

Just looked at the wiki link it was for a even fifty.

Now that is very interesting a Jewish gangster with a big shtick.