Incendiary quarrels/arrows/crossbow bolts

fearn · 23rd October 2008, 06:55 PM

Slightly off-topic, but apropo for this thread:

Last night (10/22/08), Mythbusters, the US TV program, built and fired a korean hwacha, which is basically a mobile platform for launching 200 fire arrows (powered by blackpowder rocket motors, and exploding on impact). It was worth watching, and it looks like it will be broadcast again tonight (10/23) and 11/2 in the US.

Just FYI. It's fun to see these weapons in action.
F

Matchlock · 23rd October 2008, 11:07 PM

The watercolors are from the 1485 Landshut/Bavaria armory inventory of which I posted some firearms illustrations in another thread.

Note that the arrows have only one point - as Stekemest wrote, a feature preferably characteristic of South German and Austrian quarrel heads. Thank you again, Peter.

The line drawings were done in the 19th century after the famous South German Hauslab manuscript dated 1442, now preserved in The Royal Armories, Leeds. The watercolors illustrating the making of incendiary arrows posted here earlier are from the same ms. Luckily, those two pages of that book were open on display when I took the photos in the Tower in 1990.

Note that the burning mass on two of the arrows is lit, with smoke curling up. The ankle that both crossbow men and harquebusiers are aiming denotes that the projectiles are planned to cross a town wall and set the wooden tiles of the houses on fire - together with ship sails the main purpose of incendiary projectiles.

Michael

Matchlock · 26th October 2008, 04:25 PM

Instead of attaching these, I twice enclosed the picture of the cut open fuse.

Next to the two big gray clay grenades there is the small cast iron hand grenade that I posted above.

There is an interesting story to the clay grenades. Hundreds of them were discovered in the Bavarian city of Ingolstadt in May 1983 when a subterraneous garage was built. The grenades were found alongside the old town wall stored on boards covered with straw, all perfectly preserved in the clay ground - see b/w photos.

As they weigh about 4 kilos each I would not refer to them as hand grenades. Being kept ready and primed along the town wall rather indicates that they were lit and just dropped to explode among the besiegers.

Michael

Matchlock · 2nd November 2008, 01:13 AM

More clay grenades of the Thirty Years War, all dug up in Ingolstadt.

I found these pictures on Ebay in November 2007; one image even shows the actual weight of a (comparatively small) grenade: 2,873 kilograms. Some of them were heavily damaged, probably due to the crude teeth of the dredgers.
The fuses are all gone and I doubt whether they had retained their 'fillings' ...

Michael

Matchlock · 3rd November 2008, 03:21 PM

Mid 15th century.

They were analyzed and X-rayed a few years ago. The substances of the incendiary mass were found to be almost the same as in the Swiss arrows in the Schweizerisches Landesmuseum Zurich (see my earlier post), with the exception that the outer layer of the Nuremberg arrows is made of tissue.

Mchael

Matchlock · 13th November 2008, 12:40 PM

Offered by an Italian auction house in June 2008.
Although the estimate was relatively low I think it failed to sell.

Michael

Matchlock · 15th November 2008, 02:20 PM

17th century, smaller and of much lighter weight than the ones dug up in Ingolstadt.

A huge iron throwing ball for a catapult above and a pair of mid 16th century miniature cannon below.

Michael

bluelake · 25th April 2012, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fearn

Slightly off-topic, but apropo for this thread:

Last night (10/22/08), Mythbusters, the US TV program, built and fired a korean hwacha, which is basically a mobile platform for launching 200 fire arrows (powered by blackpowder rocket motors, and exploding on impact). It was worth watching, and it looks like it will be broadcast again tonight (10/23) and 11/2 in the US.

Just FYI. It's fun to see these weapons in action.
F

Sorry for the response to one of the older posts, but this is the first time I saw it. Regarding the "hwacha" episode, the executive producer of the MB show consulted with me on it. I even received a short credit (in the "thanks" portion) from them.

Back on topic--

Here is a Korean fire arrow:

Matchlock · 25th April 2012, 04:24 PM

Hi Bluelake and Fearn,

It's fascinating to note how similar the basic structures of these Ethnographic and European items are!

Any idea as to the date of that Korean hwacha?

Best,
Michael

bluelake · 25th April 2012, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matchlock

Any idea as to the date of that Korean hwacha?

Best,
Michael

They date from the early Joseon dynasty (the dynasty ran from 1392-1910) and were used against the Japanese in their first invasion of Korea in 1592-98.

Matchlock · 25th April 2012, 10:35 PM

Thanks!

m

Matchlock · 9th July 2012, 11:38 PM

A huge incendiary gun arrow, from the Mary Rose (sunk in 1545).

m

Matchlock · 10th July 2012, 10:11 PM

For incendiary and other gun arrows 1330-1570, please see

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=15788

23rd October 2008, 11:07 PM	#2
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Incediary arrows in Southern Germany, 1442 and 1485 The watercolors are from the 1485 Landshut/Bavaria armory inventory of which I posted some firearms illustrations in another thread. Note that the arrows have only one point - as Stekemest wrote, a feature preferably characteristic of South German and Austrian quarrel heads. Thank you again, Peter. The line drawings were done in the 19th century after the famous South German Hauslab manuscript dated 1442, now preserved in The Royal Armories, Leeds. The watercolors illustrating the making of incendiary arrows posted here earlier are from the same ms. Luckily, those two pages of that book were open on display when I took the photos in the Tower in 1990. Note that the burning mass on two of the arrows is lit, with smoke curling up. The ankle that both crossbow men and harquebusiers are aiming denotes that the projectiles are planned to cross a town wall and set the wooden tiles of the houses on fire - together with ship sails the main purpose of incendiary projectiles. Michael Attached Images

26th October 2008, 04:25 PM	#3
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Clay Grenades of the Thirty Years War Instead of attaching these, I twice enclosed the picture of the cut open fuse. Next to the two big gray clay grenades there is the small cast iron hand grenade that I posted above. There is an interesting story to the clay grenades. Hundreds of them were discovered in the Bavarian city of Ingolstadt in May 1983 when a subterraneous garage was built. The grenades were found alongside the old town wall stored on boards covered with straw, all perfectly preserved in the clay ground - see b/w photos. As they weigh about 4 kilos each I would not refer to them as hand grenades. Being kept ready and primed along the town wall rather indicates that they were lit and just dropped to explode among the besiegers. Michael Attached Images

2nd November 2008, 01:13 AM	#4
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	More clay grenades of the Thirty Years War, all dug up in Ingolstadt. I found these pictures on Ebay in November 2007; one image even shows the actual weight of a (comparatively small) grenade: 2,873 kilograms. Some of them were heavily damaged, probably due to the crude teeth of the dredgers. The fuses are all gone and I doubt whether they had retained their 'fillings' ... Michael Attached Images

3rd November 2008, 03:21 PM	#5
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Incendiary arrows in the Nuremberg castle Mid 15th century. They were analyzed and X-rayed a few years ago. The substances of the incendiary mass were found to be almost the same as in the Swiss arrows in the Schweizerisches Landesmuseum Zurich (see my earlier post), with the exception that the outer layer of the Nuremberg arrows is made of tissue. Mchael Attached Images

13th November 2008, 12:40 PM	#6
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Another quoit Offered by an Italian auction house in June 2008. Although the estimate was relatively low I think it failed to sell. Michael Attached Images

23rd October 2008, 06:55 PM	#1
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Slightly off-topic, but apropo for this thread: Last night (10/22/08), Mythbusters, the US TV program, built and fired a korean hwacha, which is basically a mobile platform for launching 200 fire arrows (powered by blackpowder rocket motors, and exploding on impact). It was worth watching, and it looks like it will be broadcast again tonight (10/23) and 11/2 in the US. Just FYI. It's fun to see these weapons in action. F

15th November 2008, 02:20 PM	#7
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Clay grenades in the Veste (castle) Oberhaus, Passau, Eastern Bavaria 17th century, smaller and of much lighter weight than the ones dug up in Ingolstadt. A huge iron throwing ball for a catapult above and a pair of mid 16th century miniature cannon below. Michael Attached Images

25th April 2012, 04:24 PM	#9
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Hi Bluelake and Fearn, It's fascinating to note how similar the basic structures of these Ethnographic and European items are! Any idea as to the date of that Korean hwacha? Best, Michael

25th April 2012, 10:35 PM	#11
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Thanks! m

9th July 2012, 11:38 PM	#12
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	A huge incendiary gun arrow, from the Mary Rose (sunk in 1545). m Attached Images Last edited by Matchlock; 10th July 2012 at 10:09 PM.

10th July 2012, 10:11 PM	#13
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	For incendiary and other gun arrows 1330-1570, please see http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=15788