My first Keris.....but is it a good one??

lemmythesmith · 11th August 2008, 08:43 PM

Hi Katana, congratulations on your first keris!! I bid on that one too

It looks like a Bali "tourist" dress, but is nicely carved. The blade looks to be a good one with real pamor clearly visible. I can't really tell from the sellers photo but the pamor threads seem to continue their pattern into the gongo so it may be one piece with the blade-gongo iras.

A. G. Maisey · 11th August 2008, 11:11 PM

Yes, it is tourist dress, but not a bad example.

I think you'll find that the blade has a gonjo.

I looked this up on UK ebay. For what you paid, you did well.

However, I think that you will find that the "jewels" are plastic---if you're real lucky they might be glass.

asomotif · 12th August 2008, 11:58 AM

Quote:

I think that you will find that the "jewels" are plastic---if you're real lucky they might be glass.

Often they are indeed semi precious plastic

A. G. Maisey · 12th August 2008, 01:37 PM

You know, theoretically plastic jewels are just fine in Bali art work. All the texts tell us that in Bali art the important thing is the final effect,not the value of the materials used to achieve that effect, this is the reason that you will not infrequently find diamonds and rubies mixed up with glass in court pieces.

So, if you need to use a bit of plastic to achieve that final effect, does it matter?

My guess is that it does not matter to the Balinese, although we might find it a bit off-putting. But they don't really have to please us bules, do they?

katana · 12th August 2008, 05:41 PM

Thank you very much for all your replies

Sorry lemmythesmith for 'pipping you at the post'

It was the blade's obvious pamor and the nicely carved hilt that attracted me. I wanted at least one to add to my collection. (mind you, I said that when I obtained a Dha ...and now I have two

)
Should I be alittle disappointed that this is in 'tourist dress' ? Hopefully, the jewels are not 'semi-precious' plastic

But having said that, plastic strips were highly prized by a number of African tribes, due to its scarcity. Thanks A. G. Maisey for the 'hint' about the price I paid, its nice to know I didn't pay over the odds.

When I receive it I will post better pictures and discription.

Kind Regards David

David · 12th August 2008, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by katana

Should I be alittle disappointed that this is in 'tourist dress' ?

Well, that depends on what you were looking for in the first place. As has been pointed out, as this particular "tourist" dress form goes, this one is fairly well executed. But this isn't the type of dress that you would expect to find on a blade that was used within the culture in the time period that this blade is from. This is a reasonably nice old Bali blade as far as i can tell from these photos. The dress, however, is probably no older that the 1960s, maybe later (does anybody know when this type of dress first appeared?) and AFAIK never the type of dress that was used within the culture for a serious person's keris. I have heard it suggested that this type of dress may have been used for theatrical purposes, but i have never had that confirmed.
To re-dress this blade probably would not be worth it to you. As is i would say it is definitely worth having, especially if your cost was low. But....if you are looking for a good example of a traditional blade (which this is) in appropriate dress (which this isn't) i am afraid that you will probably be looking for a second keris soon.

katana · 12th August 2008, 07:44 PM

Hi David

,
thanks for the 'enlightenment', I actually quite like the 'dress' as it is......its the word 'tourist' ...it always gives me the impression of 'poor quality', souvenir wallhangers....which this one does not seem to be. I have seen some 'tourist quality' keris before, these had thin blades and poorly carved hilts ...so please excuse my knee jerk reaction to the word.. 'tourist'

Regards David

PS You are probably right, I can see this one being the first...of a few

11th August 2008, 08:43 PM	#1
lemmythesmith Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 93	Hi Katana, congratulations on your first keris!! I bid on that one too It looks like a Bali "tourist" dress, but is nicely carved. The blade looks to be a good one with real pamor clearly visible. I can't really tell from the sellers photo but the pamor threads seem to continue their pattern into the gongo so it may be one piece with the blade-gongo iras.

11th August 2008, 11:11 PM	#2
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,059	Yes, it is tourist dress, but not a bad example. I think you'll find that the blade has a gonjo. I looked this up on UK ebay. For what you paid, you did well. However, I think that you will find that the "jewels" are plastic---if you're real lucky they might be glass.

12th August 2008, 01:37 PM	#4
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,059	You know, theoretically plastic jewels are just fine in Bali art work. All the texts tell us that in Bali art the important thing is the final effect,not the value of the materials used to achieve that effect, this is the reason that you will not infrequently find diamonds and rubies mixed up with glass in court pieces. So, if you need to use a bit of plastic to achieve that final effect, does it matter? My guess is that it does not matter to the Balinese, although we might find it a bit off-putting. But they don't really have to please us bules, do they?

12th August 2008, 05:41 PM	#5
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	Thank you very much for all your replies Sorry lemmythesmith for 'pipping you at the post' It was the blade's obvious pamor and the nicely carved hilt that attracted me. I wanted at least one to add to my collection. (mind you, I said that when I obtained a Dha ...and now I have two ) Should I be alittle disappointed that this is in 'tourist dress' ? Hopefully, the jewels are not 'semi-precious' plastic But having said that, plastic strips were highly prized by a number of African tribes, due to its scarcity. Thanks A. G. Maisey for the 'hint' about the price I paid, its nice to know I didn't pay over the odds. When I receive it I will post better pictures and discription. Kind Regards David

12th August 2008, 07:44 PM	#7
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	Hi David , thanks for the 'enlightenment', I actually quite like the 'dress' as it is......its the word 'tourist' ...it always gives me the impression of 'poor quality', souvenir wallhangers....which this one does not seem to be. I have seen some 'tourist quality' keris before, these had thin blades and poorly carved hilts ...so please excuse my knee jerk reaction to the word.. 'tourist' Regards David PS You are probably right, I can see this one being the first...of a few