Panabas, aka Bruticus Maximus...

Federico · 25th March 2005, 12:21 AM

Ok, just wanted to clarify. While it has been theorized (eg. Bob Cato) that the weapon Panabas that we are so fond of collecting evolved from an agricultural tool, the Panabas as a weapon was not a dual use sword like a Xtian bolo. Like the Kampilan they were symbols of State power, and one can see many period pics of Mindanao court gatherings with Panabas born on the shoulders of a Datu's followers. Furthermore they played a deep role in state executions. While it has errors, Bob Cato's book does offer some glimpse into the historic role of the Panabas.

Rick · 25th March 2005, 01:38 AM

Swiped from Ebay .

Spunjer · 25th March 2005, 04:08 AM

thanks for everyone's response!

Federico, would you care to elaborate more about the panabas? to me, it's really a very enigmatic weapon/tool(?). the only thing i know about it is what i read on cato's book.

Rick, i always thought the first picture's pretty cool. as you scan thru the moros from right to left, they look like some mean SOB's that you just don't wanna mess with; that is until you get to the very last person on the left. now why did he have to pose like that?

btw, the panabas on the right looks weird. instead of the tip being flat, it's angled; seems like you can use it for thrusting. nice specimen. anyone here own something similar to that?

the bottom pic is news to me. it's kinda cool in a macabre way...

Federico · 25th March 2005, 06:26 AM

Mmmm...silver hilted Panabas, I bet there is an awesome blade underneath that scabbard. One thing to note about that picture, seated in the middle is Datu Uto, rightfully the last sultan of Buayan/Maguindanao. He was immensely powerful, as well as wealthy. In the majority of Mindanao period pics, of various datus posing with their followers, that I have seen, I have seldom seen pics of scabbards laden in precious metals. Which highlights the rarity of such pieces as being only affordable/suitable to someone such as Datu Uto, who held off Spanish control of Mindanao effectively till they were forced to leave, despite their modern weaponry. Which is also why I am very very skeptical of many, if not most lavish metal hilted/scabbarded kris that pour out of PI. Beyond the mere limits of those of wealth at the time who could afford such lavishness, were the limits of those who were of the right status to even contemplate bearing such a kris. Ok I sidetracked.

Spunjer, afraid I dont have much to add. My experience with Panabas is very limited, as well as my knowledge of them. Ive heard stories similar to the ones in Cato's book (again even Bob would admit there are errors in there), Panabas that need to be fed regularly on blood or they will seek their own meal, Panabas being held in sacred spots in the homes of royalty as valued pusaka, etc... Also stories of Panabas bearers taking the rear of the line, to "finish up" those who werent quite finished by the first wave of fighters. Nothing too unique, and well alot of it is second hand (eg. I was told this). While I trust the people who told me, I cannot say that someone else may not have more accurate information. Ive also noted, in similar period Mindnanao court pics such as the one Rick posted, you can usually spot one being borne by a warrior, highlighting its role as symbol of State Power. Anyways, if one looks at alot of the more modern ag-based panabas that pop up on ebay, one can easily see a big difference in style/look. One can also see the connection between the evolution of the Panabas. However, its kinda like the garab/talibong. While there is a superficial resemblence to a more modern ag tool, its history as a fighting only weapon is beyond mere looks. Anyways, I suppose this isnt too helpful, but hopefully someone who knows more about Panabas can shed further light.

Conogre · 25th March 2005, 08:01 AM

Thanks for clarifying on the non-duality of the panabas, Federico, with what you stated being what I've suspected since I personally held one, as they are simply too heavy to be used in harvesting rice, no matter what the blade is shaped like.
In some instances, the weight of a particular bladed piece would seem to have immense bearing on its use as a weapon in spite of what is thought to be used for, often based upon what it's shape resembles.
If too heavy to be used in harvesting a food crop, such as rice, and with a hilt that wouldn't stand up if used in lieu of an axe, not much is left for a purpose besides a weapon if one uses common sense and the process of elimination.
Mike

Bill · 25th March 2005, 08:10 PM

an interesting thing is one can easily look up PI court documents about criminal trials, on the internet. There is a number of murder trials (receint)that the panabas is the weapon, often being described as a agricultural tool. Little doubt the "Moro" panabas was strickly used as a weapon, but likely there was also a tool that at times was used as a weapon, then, as now.

Conogre · 25th March 2005, 10:21 PM

A very good point, Bill.
Does anyone know of a non-Moro tool or impliment that resembles a panabas from the PI, or even a Moro equivelent used JUST for agriculture?
Mike

Ian · 29th March 2005, 11:21 PM

Guys:

The picture of the assembled Moro dignitaries is dominated by the two Americans in white and I am really surprised that an immigrant to the U.S. is the one to point out that the rotund gentleman in the center of the picture is William Howard Taft, then Governor of the Philippines and later President of the United States. Taft had left the Philippines by 1904, and from 1904-1908 he was supervising the construction of the Panama Canal.

The other distinguished gentleman in white is Major General Leonard Wood, Governor of Moro Province and later Army Chief of Staff under President Taft. Wood was only in the Philippines briefly, serving as Governor of Moro Province from 1903-1906, during which time he commanded U.S. troops in putting down a Moro rebellion in 1904. I believe the photograph dates from 1903-1904, when both Taft and Wood were in the Philippines.

Because the Moro in this picture are carrying weapons in close proximity to the distinguished U.S. administrators, it was probably taken before the Moro uprising that was put down by Wood. So I would guess the picture dates from 1903.

Very interesting picture.

Ian.

In the time I was posting my message, Federico beat me to the ID of Taft.

Conogre · 30th March 2005, 12:19 AM

BUT he's too young to possibly know that he was later President Taft (maybe anyways).
An immigrant, by the way,Ian, is THE logical person to be aware of such fantastic information/trivia as many to most Americans have little interest in our own history.
Perhaps because there is so little of it? **grin**
Mike

25th March 2005, 01:38 AM	#2
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,347	Swiped from Ebay . Attached Images

29th March 2005, 11:21 PM	#8
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,453	Guys: The picture of the assembled Moro dignitaries is dominated by the two Americans in white and I am really surprised that an immigrant to the U.S. is the one to point out that the rotund gentleman in the center of the picture is William Howard Taft, then Governor of the Philippines and later President of the United States. Taft had left the Philippines by 1904, and from 1904-1908 he was supervising the construction of the Panama Canal. The other distinguished gentleman in white is Major General Leonard Wood, Governor of Moro Province and later Army Chief of Staff under President Taft. Wood was only in the Philippines briefly, serving as Governor of Moro Province from 1903-1906, during which time he commanded U.S. troops in putting down a Moro rebellion in 1904. I believe the photograph dates from 1903-1904, when both Taft and Wood were in the Philippines. Because the Moro in this picture are carrying weapons in close proximity to the distinguished U.S. administrators, it was probably taken before the Moro uprising that was put down by Wood. So I would guess the picture dates from 1903. Very interesting picture. Ian. In the time I was posting my message, Federico beat me to the ID of Taft. Last edited by Ian; 30th March 2005 at 12:16 AM.

25th March 2005, 12:21 AM	#1
Federico Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Minneapolis, MN, USA Posts: 312	Ok, just wanted to clarify. While it has been theorized (eg. Bob Cato) that the weapon Panabas that we are so fond of collecting evolved from an agricultural tool, the Panabas as a weapon was not a dual use sword like a Xtian bolo. Like the Kampilan they were symbols of State power, and one can see many period pics of Mindanao court gatherings with Panabas born on the shoulders of a Datu's followers. Furthermore they played a deep role in state executions. While it has errors, Bob Cato's book does offer some glimpse into the historic role of the Panabas.

25th March 2005, 04:08 AM	#3
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	thanks for everyone's response! Federico, would you care to elaborate more about the panabas? to me, it's really a very enigmatic weapon/tool(?). the only thing i know about it is what i read on cato's book. Rick, i always thought the first picture's pretty cool. as you scan thru the moros from right to left, they look like some mean SOB's that you just don't wanna mess with; that is until you get to the very last person on the left. now why did he have to pose like that? btw, the panabas on the right looks weird. instead of the tip being flat, it's angled; seems like you can use it for thrusting. nice specimen. anyone here own something similar to that? the bottom pic is news to me. it's kinda cool in a macabre way...

25th March 2005, 06:26 AM	#4
Federico Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Minneapolis, MN, USA Posts: 312	Mmmm...silver hilted Panabas, I bet there is an awesome blade underneath that scabbard. One thing to note about that picture, seated in the middle is Datu Uto, rightfully the last sultan of Buayan/Maguindanao. He was immensely powerful, as well as wealthy. In the majority of Mindanao period pics, of various datus posing with their followers, that I have seen, I have seldom seen pics of scabbards laden in precious metals. Which highlights the rarity of such pieces as being only affordable/suitable to someone such as Datu Uto, who held off Spanish control of Mindanao effectively till they were forced to leave, despite their modern weaponry. Which is also why I am very very skeptical of many, if not most lavish metal hilted/scabbarded kris that pour out of PI. Beyond the mere limits of those of wealth at the time who could afford such lavishness, were the limits of those who were of the right status to even contemplate bearing such a kris. Ok I sidetracked. Spunjer, afraid I dont have much to add. My experience with Panabas is very limited, as well as my knowledge of them. Ive heard stories similar to the ones in Cato's book (again even Bob would admit there are errors in there), Panabas that need to be fed regularly on blood or they will seek their own meal, Panabas being held in sacred spots in the homes of royalty as valued pusaka, etc... Also stories of Panabas bearers taking the rear of the line, to "finish up" those who werent quite finished by the first wave of fighters. Nothing too unique, and well alot of it is second hand (eg. I was told this). While I trust the people who told me, I cannot say that someone else may not have more accurate information. Ive also noted, in similar period Mindnanao court pics such as the one Rick posted, you can usually spot one being borne by a warrior, highlighting its role as symbol of State Power. Anyways, if one looks at alot of the more modern ag-based panabas that pop up on ebay, one can easily see a big difference in style/look. One can also see the connection between the evolution of the Panabas. However, its kinda like the garab/talibong. While there is a superficial resemblence to a more modern ag tool, its history as a fighting only weapon is beyond mere looks. Anyways, I suppose this isnt too helpful, but hopefully someone who knows more about Panabas can shed further light.

25th March 2005, 08:01 AM	#5
Conogre Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 371	Thanks for clarifying on the non-duality of the panabas, Federico, with what you stated being what I've suspected since I personally held one, as they are simply too heavy to be used in harvesting rice, no matter what the blade is shaped like. In some instances, the weight of a particular bladed piece would seem to have immense bearing on its use as a weapon in spite of what is thought to be used for, often based upon what it's shape resembles. If too heavy to be used in harvesting a food crop, such as rice, and with a hilt that wouldn't stand up if used in lieu of an axe, not much is left for a purpose besides a weapon if one uses common sense and the process of elimination. Mike

25th March 2005, 08:10 PM	#6
Bill Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Chicago area Posts: 327	an interesting thing is one can easily look up PI court documents about criminal trials, on the internet. There is a number of murder trials (receint)that the panabas is the weapon, often being described as a agricultural tool. Little doubt the "Moro" panabas was strickly used as a weapon, but likely there was also a tool that at times was used as a weapon, then, as now.

25th March 2005, 10:21 PM	#7
Conogre Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 371	A very good point, Bill. Does anyone know of a non-Moro tool or impliment that resembles a panabas from the PI, or even a Moro equivelent used JUST for agriculture? Mike

30th March 2005, 12:19 AM	#9
Conogre Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 371	BUT he's too young to possibly know that he was later President Taft (maybe anyways). An immigrant, by the way,Ian, is THE logical person to be aware of such fantastic information/trivia as many to most Americans have little interest in our own history. Perhaps because there is so little of it? grin Mike