Two Salawar yataghans - khyber knives

[Emanuel]

Originally Posted by spiral

Where does that presumably well reserched statement come from?



Spiral

picked it up from one quote or another floating around this forum at some point in the last three years. Some were indeed from Kipling, as Ariel noted, others were from somewhere else. There was specific mention of the khyber knife. And besides, the British were probably the only modern occupant that got to see this big knife in action. Afterwards modern guns took over, no?
I suppose I could track those quotes down...but from that wink of yours I don't think I need to.

Emanuel

[Emanuel]

It's true that both of mine also have a slight recurve on the spine, on the third of the blade closest to the tip. Lew that one look like it was cut down from a bigger one.

[Lew]

Originally Posted by Manolo

Lew that one look like it was cut down from a bigger one.

Manolo

Nope thats this one's original size and shape.

Lew

[katana]

Hi Emanuel,
here my Khyber Knife ...with a straight edge along side to show the curveture of the blade. It has great balance and a very sharp edge.....one of my favorites

[spiral]

Originally Posted by Manolo

picked it up from one quote or another floating around this forum at some point in the last three years. Some were indeed from Kipling, as Ariel noted, others were from somewhere else. There was specific mention of the khyber knife. And besides, the British were probably the only modern occupant that got to see this big knife in action. Afterwards modern guns took over, no?
I suppose I could track those quotes down...but from that wink of yours I don't think I need to.

Emanuel

No research required Emmanuel, I just cant imagine any empire men bieng scared of an inanimate object! {Although the lawmakers & many citizens of today are decidly more nervous of big knives! }

Spiral

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by Manolo

picked it up from one quote or another floating around this forum at some point in the last three years. Some were indeed from Kipling, as Ariel noted, others were from somewhere else. There was specific mention of the khyber knife. And besides, the British were probably the only modern occupant that got to see this big knife in action. Afterwards modern guns took over, no?
I suppose I could track those quotes down...but from that wink of yours I don't think I need to.

Emanuel

I'm not sure of any quotes that stated that the British were afraid of the deadly Khyber knives, but since we have already cited Kipling, I found these.
It would seem that 'fear' might not be the exact word, but for certain, the British were keenly aware of the 'Khyber' in specific, and seem to have carried a certain respect for them and in degree, the warriors.

"...they have taken the oath of the Brother in the blood and fire of the fresh cut sod; on the hilt and the haft of the Khyber knife, and the wondrous names of God."
-"Ballad of East and West", Kipling


"...Yur Khan drew clear the Khyber knife and struck, and sheathed again".
-The Ballad of the Kings Mercy", Kipling

Best regards,
Jim

[spiral]

mmmm thanks Jim,

The British were knew of the Gurkha the Pathan & the Sikh as also recorded according to Kipling .

We bought or killed most of their leaders usualy.... But the only the "Fuzzy wuzzys" got his ultimate respect. as the man himself said while in the Early Campaigns of the
Sudan Expeditionary Force,
---------------------------------------------------------------

"Fuzzy-Wuzzy"

"We've fought with many men acrost the seas,
..........And some of 'em was brave an' some was not:
The Paythan an' the Zulu an' Burmese;
..........But the Fuzzy was the finest o' the lot.
We never got a ha'porth's change of 'im:
..........'E squatted in the scrub and 'ocked our 'orses,
'E cut our sentries up at Suakim,
..........An' 'e played the cat an' banjo with our forces.
...............So 'ere's to you, Fuzzy-Wuzzy, at your 'ome in the Soudan;
...............Yore a pore benighted 'eathen but a first-class fightin' man;
...............We gives you your certificate, an' if you want it signed,
...............We'll come an' 'ave a romp with you whenever you're inclined.



We took our chanst among the Kyber 'ills,
..........The Boers knocked us silly at a mile,
The Burman guv us Irriwaddy chills,
..........An' a Zulu impi dished us up in style:
But all we ever got from such as they
..........Was pop to what the Fuzzy made us swaller;
We 'eld our bloomin' own, the papers say,
..........But man for man the Fuzzy knocked us 'oller.
...............Then 'ere's to you, Fuzzy-Wuzzy, an' the missis and the kid:
...............Our orders was to break you, an' of course we went an' did.
...............We sloshed you with Martinis, an' it wasn't 'ardly fair;
...............But for all the odds agin' you, Fuzzy-Wuz, you broke the square.



'E 'asn't got no papers of 'is own,
..........'E 'asn't got no medals nor rewards,
So we must certify the skill 'e's shown
..........In usin' of 'is long two-'anded swords:
When 'e's 'oppin' in an' out among the bush
..........With 'is coffin-'eaded shield an' shovel-spear,
An 'appy day with Fuzzy on the rush
..........Will last an 'ealthy Tommy for a year.
...............So 'ere's to you, Fuzzy-Wuzzy, an' your friends which are no more,
...............If we 'adn't lost some messmates we would 'elp you to deplore.
...............But give an' take's the gospel, an' we'll call the bargain fair,
...............For if you 'ave lost more than us, you crumpled up the square!
'E rushes at the smoke when we let drive,
..........An', before we know, 'e's 'ackin' at our 'ead;
'E's all 'ot sand an' ginger when alive,
..........An' 'e's generally shammin' when 'e's dead.
'E's a daisy, 'e's a ducky, 'e's a lamb!
..........'E's a injia-rubber idiot on a spree,
'E's the on'y thing that doesn't give a damn
..........For a Regiment o' British Infantree!



...............So 'ere's to you, Fuzzy-Wuzzy, at your 'ome in the Soudan;
...............You're a pore benighted 'eathen but a first-class fightin' man;
...............An' 'ere's to you, Fuzzy-Wuzzy, with your 'ayrick 'ead of 'air -
...............You big black boundin' beggar - for you broke a British square! "


-------------------------------------------------------------------------


Not a man to be scared of a big knife I think.... But he respected a fighter, my understanding is that was the usual Brit. approch , kill em or Buy em. But respect a fighter. It worked well.

You dont enslave half the world bieng timid.... of course the technology helped then as it does in war today

Strange its still war in the same countries...... Or not I guess.

Spiral

[Emanuel]

Hi Jim and Spiral,

I really have no idea where I picked that up. It was something about an individual soldier or some British individual writing about the khyber. The feelings it conveyed were awe and yes, fear. I admit my generalization of the British fearing the khyber was incorrect. Knives are no match for guns and superior tactics, after all. Now I will try to dig that damn quote up just to lay things to rest

I like that poem, Spiral. It's an inspiring way to remember the Hadendoa.

Cheers!
Emanuel

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by Manolo

Hi Jim and Spiral,

I really have no idea where I picked that up. It was something about an individual soldier or some British individual writing about the khyber. The feelings it conveyed were awe and yes, fear. I admit my generalization of the British fearing the khyber was incorrect. Knives are no match for guns and superior tactics, after all. Now I will try to dig that damn quote up just to lay things to rest

I like that poem, Spiral. It's an inspiring way to remember the Hadendoa.

Cheers!
Emanuel

Hi Emanuel,
I can totally relate.....I cant stand it when there is a reference or a quote I cant relocate! It makes me want to put everything on some kind of tape or recording!!

All the best,
Jim

[spiral]

Ok Emmanuel, I admit all my posts were a bit tounge in cheek , but yes the "Empire Men" seemed to do ok in those days.

I agree its a great way to remember the Hadendoa.

Spiral

[Emanuel]

I know Spiral I think I've gotten used to reading your posts well enough. And your wink was also a good indicator of your disposition. Folks should use emoticons more often, they're useful.
I still haven't found that quote, Jim, and I'm sure enough I didn't imagine it. I will find it though and post it for future reference.

All the best,
Emanuel