Musketeers/ Rifleholders

fernando · 27th October 2007, 08:13 PM

Hi Rand

I know you are completely aware of the following, but here i go:

Usually when you want to convert a flint or miquelete gun into percussion, you adapt the existing lock by taking some parts and changing others, like the cock. This way you leave the old lock plate in its particular stock wood inset.
However some times the only part you want to save is the barrel, due to its quality or sentimental reason and, in such case, the new stock is configured to allocate the new system lock plate. The only actual alteration is on the barrel, that has to receive a new type of fire hole.

I think your gun falls in this second version.

I am posting pictures of both versions, from my junk collection.
The first is a Spanish miquelete hunting gun, very much worn, with very old repairs, converted to percussion. Around 1830 massive quantities of muskets and pistols were converted to percussion, both military and civilian.

The second example is a Portuguese clavina, dating from the Napoleonic invasions, with a ( extremely short ) barrel originated in a flintlock action and later fitted into a barrel with a percussion lock.

Both these modifications were in principle a regional civilian work.

Naturally these pieces had an agitated life and have a long story to tell, but by no means they can compare to your luxury rifle.

Kind regards
Fernando

fernando · 27th October 2007, 08:20 PM

The clavina

Battara · 27th October 2007, 08:59 PM

Wonderful pieces folks, many thanks for sharing these!

Jens Nordlunde · 27th October 2007, 09:32 PM

Thank you Fernando, they are really very nice pieces, and although I do not collect firearms myself, I do appreciate them, and the decoration of them.

rand · 30th October 2007, 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fernando

The clavina

Correct me if I am wrong, but believe the type of percussion lock that is on the Clavina dates prior to 1835.

rand

fernando · 31st October 2007, 08:50 PM

Hi Rand

Quote:

Originally Posted by rand

Correct me if I am wrong, but believe the type of percussion lock that is on the Clavina dates prior to 1835.

I am sorry i don't have enough references or the knowledge to confirm that.
In contextual terms i beleive this lock was assembled around 1830, but i have no evidence.

However there is a determined particular in it, that might be an indicator for collectors with more expertize, which is a little notch in the hammer head, certainly for serving some purpose.

I also have this type of detail in the hammers of a double barrel pistol i could never identify which, considering its crude characteristics, was certainly a hand made private work, therefore gaining the ethnographic status.

If you are able to confirm the period of this lock pattern, as being previous to 1830, i will be happy to also get a first impression on the age of the pistol, which i ignore so far.

By the way ...
Although the above examples don't have to be the case, i am aware that, in the beginning of percussion, at least in the first Portuguese modifications, some models had the priming cap inserted in the hammer head , instead of coupled on the nipples
Best regards
Fernando

rand · 2nd November 2007, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fernando

The clavina

Hey Fernando,

Found a reference for the back action percussion lock and its stated that the earliest forms of this style date from 1835-1840.

http://www.muzzleloaders-etcetera.co...w_of_locks.htm

You need to scroll down to the percussion locks.....

rand

fernando · 2nd November 2007, 08:22 PM

Hi Rand

Quote:

Originally Posted by rand

Hey Fernando,

Found a reference for the back action percussion lock and its stated that the earliest forms of this style date from 1835-1840.

http://www.muzzleloaders-etcetera.co...w_of_locks.htm

You need to scroll down to the percussion locks.....

rand

I knew this page.
I don't think it helps a lot, or is necessarily accurate, though.
Thanks for bringing it up, anyhow.
Fernando

27th October 2007, 08:13 PM	#1
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Hi Rand I know you are completely aware of the following, but here i go: Usually when you want to convert a flint or miquelete gun into percussion, you adapt the existing lock by taking some parts and changing others, like the cock. This way you leave the old lock plate in its particular stock wood inset. However some times the only part you want to save is the barrel, due to its quality or sentimental reason and, in such case, the new stock is configured to allocate the new system lock plate. The only actual alteration is on the barrel, that has to receive a new type of fire hole. I think your gun falls in this second version. I am posting pictures of both versions, from my junk collection. The first is a Spanish miquelete hunting gun, very much worn, with very old repairs, converted to percussion. Around 1830 massive quantities of muskets and pistols were converted to percussion, both military and civilian. The second example is a Portuguese clavina, dating from the Napoleonic invasions, with a ( extremely short ) barrel originated in a flintlock action and later fitted into a barrel with a percussion lock. Both these modifications were in principle a regional civilian work. Naturally these pieces had an agitated life and have a long story to tell, but by no means they can compare to your luxury rifle. Kind regards Fernando Attached Images Last edited by fernando; 27th October 2007 at 09:12 PM.

27th October 2007, 08:20 PM	#2
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	The clavina Attached Images

27th October 2007, 08:59 PM	#3
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,310	Wonderful pieces folks, many thanks for sharing these!

27th October 2007, 09:32 PM	#4
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Thank you Fernando, they are really very nice pieces, and although I do not collect firearms myself, I do appreciate them, and the decoration of them.