A Unique Kattar?

Tomb22 · 15th October 2007, 07:11 PM

Here are a couple more pictures. I added a few more of blade. I have seen in other posts concerning cleaning the blade to get the rust, dirt etc off. Do you have any suggestions? I know that I probably shouldn't do anything to the koftgari?? If I clean the blade, does that affect its value? Is there something that can be put on it to protect it? Both the koftgari and the blade.

In a previous post, Jim suggested maybe the age from the Tipu Sultan era? That was exciting to think about but, how does the two different ages play into that? And, whether or not, Tipu Sultan -from almost everyone's comments, it certainly seems to be a ceremonial/court weapon.

Again, I appreciate your interest and comments.

Best Regards
Tom

Robert · 15th October 2007, 09:19 PM

I have seen and used small holes like this to help secure enamel on jewelry. Maybe this piece was enameled at one time? I might also suggest that if there is a pattern to the holes that go all the way through that they may at one time have had gold or silver pins in them also another way to help secure enameling.

Robert

Tomb22 · 15th October 2007, 09:29 PM

Hi Robert,
Thanks for the input. Someone else mentioned using the holes to secure silver. Being such a neophyte, I have to ask the question. How does it work for the holes to secure the enamel? Is it some sort of "glue?" or something mechanical?

Whew, so much to learn but, so much fun for an information junkie like me.

Regards
Tom

Robert · 15th October 2007, 09:37 PM

Tom,
The pins would usually have a small head and the enamel flows under this helping to hold it in place.

Robert

Jens Nordlunde · 15th October 2007, 09:50 PM

Tom, thanks for the very good pictures. I now see what you mean about the little holes, but to my opinion they are there for decoration. Have a look at the hilt, it is worn, but by soft hands – how many years do you think this would have taken?

Have a look at the langet, it is even worn more, but this time from a wooden scabbard. Then have a look at the decoration of the blade, why would this decoration not have been worn from the in and out of the wooden scabbard? It should have been, but it is not, on the contrary it seems to be rather crisp. So like Rand suggests, have a look under the langet, you may find the answer there.

Once again, I agree with Rand, the hilt is older than the blade.

I would, but let me stress, that this is my opinion, clean the holes - carefully.

Tomb22 · 15th October 2007, 10:25 PM

Thanks Robert. I am always amazed at the ingenuity of us humans. Especially when it comes to mechanical things. I am a word guy, and just marvel at what folks with mechanical skills, brains, and creativity can do.

Jens, Good point. I agree with both you and Rand. It seems clear when you are looking for it, the differences between the hilt and the blade. So that seems to be the start of two searches. One related to the blade and one related to the hilt. There are so many aspects to this historical searching.

I will very carefully start to clean the holes. After that, what is the best to take off the rust on the blade? And then, do you "oil" it? I think I remember from another post your suggestion for car wax on the blade. Is that correct?

So, I don't keep "pestering" you with these maintenance questions, there might be threads related to cleaning and maintaining these great artifacts.

Tom

Jens Nordlunde · 16th October 2007, 03:44 PM

Tom, you should remove the rust, but for the rest you should rather clean it too little than too much, as you can always clean it a little more, but if you have gone too far you can’t go back.

I use to clean the weapon with acetone so there is no oil left, rub it with solid car wax and polish it a bit, this will protect it from fingerprints an damp.

When it comes to the Indian way of enamelling, make a search for ‘Enamelling’.

15th October 2007, 07:11 PM	#1
Tomb22 Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 17	Here are a couple more pictures. I added a few more of blade. I have seen in other posts concerning cleaning the blade to get the rust, dirt etc off. Do you have any suggestions? I know that I probably shouldn't do anything to the koftgari?? If I clean the blade, does that affect its value? Is there something that can be put on it to protect it? Both the koftgari and the blade. In a previous post, Jim suggested maybe the age from the Tipu Sultan era? That was exciting to think about but, how does the two different ages play into that? And, whether or not, Tipu Sultan -from almost everyone's comments, it certainly seems to be a ceremonial/court weapon. Again, I appreciate your interest and comments. Best Regards Tom Attached Images

15th October 2007, 09:19 PM	#2
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	I have seen and used small holes like this to help secure enamel on jewelry. Maybe this piece was enameled at one time? I might also suggest that if there is a pattern to the holes that go all the way through that they may at one time have had gold or silver pins in them also another way to help secure enameling. Robert

15th October 2007, 09:29 PM	#3
Tomb22 Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 17	Hi Robert, Thanks for the input. Someone else mentioned using the holes to secure silver. Being such a neophyte, I have to ask the question. How does it work for the holes to secure the enamel? Is it some sort of "glue?" or something mechanical? Whew, so much to learn but, so much fun for an information junkie like me. Regards Tom

15th October 2007, 09:37 PM	#4
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	Tom, The pins would usually have a small head and the enamel flows under this helping to hold it in place. Robert

15th October 2007, 09:50 PM	#5
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Tom, thanks for the very good pictures. I now see what you mean about the little holes, but to my opinion they are there for decoration. Have a look at the hilt, it is worn, but by soft hands – how many years do you think this would have taken? Have a look at the langet, it is even worn more, but this time from a wooden scabbard. Then have a look at the decoration of the blade, why would this decoration not have been worn from the in and out of the wooden scabbard? It should have been, but it is not, on the contrary it seems to be rather crisp. So like Rand suggests, have a look under the langet, you may find the answer there. Once again, I agree with Rand, the hilt is older than the blade. I would, but let me stress, that this is my opinion, clean the holes - carefully.

15th October 2007, 10:25 PM	#6
Tomb22 Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 17	Thanks Robert. I am always amazed at the ingenuity of us humans. Especially when it comes to mechanical things. I am a word guy, and just marvel at what folks with mechanical skills, brains, and creativity can do. Jens, Good point. I agree with both you and Rand. It seems clear when you are looking for it, the differences between the hilt and the blade. So that seems to be the start of two searches. One related to the blade and one related to the hilt. There are so many aspects to this historical searching. I will very carefully start to clean the holes. After that, what is the best to take off the rust on the blade? And then, do you "oil" it? I think I remember from another post your suggestion for car wax on the blade. Is that correct? So, I don't keep "pestering" you with these maintenance questions, there might be threads related to cleaning and maintaining these great artifacts. Tom

16th October 2007, 03:44 PM	#7
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Tom, you should remove the rust, but for the rest you should rather clean it too little than too much, as you can always clean it a little more, but if you have gone too far you can’t go back. I use to clean the weapon with acetone so there is no oil left, rub it with solid car wax and polish it a bit, this will protect it from fingerprints an damp. When it comes to the Indian way of enamelling, make a search for ‘Enamelling’.