Interesting Kris for comments

David · 28th March 2007, 10:23 PM

Yeah Bill (Marsh), this blade seems to exhibit far too many Indo/Malay keris features to be a Moro kris. There is even a very well developed (and extented) tikel alis. The gonjo, as Kai already stated, is much more an Indo than a Moro form. And without a good staining i wouldn't even be so sure that the pamor is a low contrast material (i really think you should stain it Bill

).
Bill (the other one), i am with Kai and i don't believe this keris necessarily pre-dates the Moro kris. No, a relocated Indo/Malay smith wouldn't "just start making a "kris" because he is on Philippine soil". He would be asked to make one because that is his skill. If indeed this blade was made in Moroland and is old enough, it could be that it still exhibits Malay/Indo traits because it is transitional from Indo to Moro need. Still, if i were a betting man

i would wager this blade was made in Indonesian (Sumatra or Sulawesi) early on, but still after the introduction of Moroland kris.
Kai, you may still be right about Riau or the Straits, but this type of pamor looks more like what i would associate with Celebes or Sumatra.

kai · 28th March 2007, 11:04 PM

Hello David,

Quote:

There is even a very well developed (and extented) tikel alis.

Yeah, that one caught my eye, too.

That's also present on the archaic Moro kris, however, the execution is different...

Quote:

And without a good staining i wouldn't even be so sure that the pamor is a low contrast material (i really think you should stain it Bill

).

I was referring to Moro kris which are usually done in low contrast. This piece seems to be regular (if Malay/Bugis) pamor though. An etch may be enough to bring out the pattern but some warangan may also be interesting.

Quote:

Kai, you may still be right about Riau or the Straits, but this type of pamor looks more like what i would associate with Celebes or Sumatra.

Yes, it's pretty common with keris blades from Palembang and places of strong Bugis influence. I'd like to hear from our Singapore/Malay members if the pamor could help in narrowing things down!

Regards,
Kai

28th March 2007, 10:23 PM	#1
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,229	Yeah Bill (Marsh), this blade seems to exhibit far too many Indo/Malay keris features to be a Moro kris. There is even a very well developed (and extented) tikel alis. The gonjo, as Kai already stated, is much more an Indo than a Moro form. And without a good staining i wouldn't even be so sure that the pamor is a low contrast material (i really think you should stain it Bill ). Bill (the other one), i am with Kai and i don't believe this keris necessarily pre-dates the Moro kris. No, a relocated Indo/Malay smith wouldn't "just start making a "kris" because he is on Philippine soil". He would be asked to make one because that is his skill. If indeed this blade was made in Moroland and is old enough, it could be that it still exhibits Malay/Indo traits because it is transitional from Indo to Moro need. Still, if i were a betting man i would wager this blade was made in Indonesian (Sumatra or Sulawesi) early on, but still after the introduction of Moroland kris. Kai, you may still be right about Riau or the Straits, but this type of pamor looks more like what i would associate with Celebes or Sumatra.