True Combat Value of Wootz

[Chris Evans]

RSWORD

I would like to express my thanks and appreciation for your efforts in posting the photos of your Wootz blades. They certainly present food for thought. As I mentioned elsewhere, it would help us enormously if somehow the edge hardness of those blades could be ascertained. A bit of very careful file testing against samples of known hardness would go a long way.....

With regards to the one that seems to have a hardened steel edge inserted, it brings to my mind a story that I was told in my student days, long ago, about clever forgeries involving a common (?) steel blade somehow overlaid with thin veneers of Wootz. I hasten to add that this never made much sense to me as the work involved would have been huge, requiring great skill - Much more likely is that here we have a composite type of sword construction that was misunderstood by Europeans.

Again, may thanks
Chris

[tsubame1]

Is the use of wootz for gun barrels enough to be considered "true combat value"?

If yes, i've already mentioned it but Philip gave a good hint in another thread :

"I suspect that the barrel on your gun is much older, with the breech altered to accept a percussion bolster and nipple. The configuration of your barrel could well indicate Persian manufacture. Without inscriptions it can be difficult to date these, but good quality ones remained in service for a long, long time.

Many of these old Persian (and Indian) barrels are of twist damascus steel. HAVE YOU TAKEN YOUR GUN APART? Often, the portion of the barrel covered by wood is less corroded and a damascus pattern might be visible."

Post n.10 here :

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=3636

[S.Al-Anizi]

Many, many thanks Chris, for that list. Ive always wanted to know, very basically, what those terms meant. I already knew simple stuff like...steel (DUH ), hardening, tempering, quenching, but not the rest. I have even printed your text for future reference.

Thanks a bunch!

[Chris Evans]

Hi S.Al-Anizi,

Originally Posted by S.Al-Anizi

Many, many thanks Chris, for that list. Ive always wanted to know, very basically, what those terms meant. I already knew simple stuff like...steel (DUH ), hardening, tempering, quenching, but not the rest. I have even printed your text for future reference.

Thanks a bunch!

Glad tp have been of some help. I wrote those definitions on the run and left out much. I suggest that if you wish to use them for future reference that you complete the picture, so to speak, by looking up more comprehensive sources

Cheers
Chris

[Chris Evans]

Hi Folks,

Just a couple of thoughts:

Something else that we do not know, in relation to Wootz, is how common was the regional concurrent usage of steel made from sponge/bloom iron. Perhaps, Wootz was a specialized steel suitable for some applications and not others.

Another question is whether the hardened steel insert edges found on some swords, as evidenced by RSWORD's beautiful example, were made from Wootz or sponge iron steel.

Cheers
Chris

[Emanuel]

Chris,
Your definitions are extremely helpful, many thanks.

As a quick aside - since wootz/patterned crucible steel was so desirable in weapons for its aesthetic properties as well as mechanical, was wootz ever used for jewellery? Are there purely decorative objects made of crucible steel and etched?

Regards,
Emanuel

[Chris Evans]

Hi Emanuel,

Originally Posted by Manolo

Chris,
Your definitions are extremely helpful, many thanks.

Thank you.

As a quick aside - since wootz/patterned crucible steel was so desirable in weapons for its aesthetic properties as well as mechanical, was wootz ever used for jewellery? Are there purely decorative objects made of crucible steel and etched?

Very good question - We need to know more about Wootz usage.

Cheers
Chris

[Andrew]

Originally Posted by tsubame1

Is the use of wootz for gun barrels enough to be considered "true combat value"?

If yes, i've already mentioned it but Philip gave a good hint in another thread :

"I suspect that the barrel on your gun is much older, with the breech altered to accept a percussion bolster and nipple. The configuration of your barrel could well indicate Persian manufacture. Without inscriptions it can be difficult to date these, but good quality ones remained in service for a long, long time.

Many of these old Persian (and Indian) barrels are of twist damascus steel. HAVE YOU TAKEN YOUR GUN APART? Often, the portion of the barrel covered by wood is less corroded and a damascus pattern might be visible."

Post n.10 here :

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=3636

Hi Carlo. I think Philip was talking about pattern welded "damascus", not wootz.