Old Argentinian facon ...

Chris Evans · 24th October 2006, 05:19 PM

Hi Ian,

I chose my words carefully when I said that "That is not a facon, at least in the nowadays regionally and commonly accepted sense of the word"

Facon simply means a large knife and all kinds of large and small knives found their way into the hands of Gauchos. Those silver hilted and ornate knives that these days are associated with them are very much a mid to late 19th century phenomena. As well, only the wealthy could afford them - Station owners, their overseers and the like.

As you can see it is not possible to say exactly what is a facon, especially what was a facon in the old days. According to some, any knife tucked into the belt of a Gaucho is a facon. However, authorities like Domenech and the late Osornio did make an attempt to standardize the terminology, though Domenech acknowledges that there is always something or another that escapes his definitions. If you care to, you may wish to drop a line to Abel Domenech and find out first hand. He speaks fluent English and has a website (down as I write this, but do a Google later)

Be all that as it may, it is certainly a very handsome piece.

Cheers
Chris

Ian · 24th October 2006, 05:27 PM

Thanks Chris. I will drop the honorable gentleman a note after I get the knife.

Ian.

fenlander · 24th October 2006, 05:39 PM

It was pointed out that the top one does not have a guard. I presume that would mean that the top knife is more likely to be ceremonial than as a knife used for fighting or dueling. Especially as it was purpose made. A decent "purpose made" fighting dagger would have a guard I presume (like the Bowie). Surely if "you" didn't have a guard but were going up against someone with a similar knife but with a guard then this would place "you" at a disadvantage.

Robert · 24th October 2006, 05:42 PM

Here is a dagger that I have had for a while now but was never quite sure where it was from. At first I thought it was from the Philippines but I'm really not sure anymore. Maybe the experts can say for sure. It is approximently 17 and 1/4" long total. 12-3/4" blade and a 4-3/4" Hilt. It is flat on one side and tapered on the other. It has a crosswork design on the Blades taper side.The Hilt and pommel are Brass and wood in an octagon configuration with some design work on the guard. It has a sheepskin or goatskin sewn sheath which has shrunk with age but it still fits on the blade.

24th October 2006, 05:27 PM	#2
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,522	Good suggestion ... Thanks Chris. I will drop the honorable gentleman a note after I get the knife. Ian.

24th October 2006, 05:39 PM	#3
fenlander Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 62	Guard It was pointed out that the top one does not have a guard. I presume that would mean that the top knife is more likely to be ceremonial than as a knife used for fighting or dueling. Especially as it was purpose made. A decent "purpose made" fighting dagger would have a guard I presume (like the Bowie). Surely if "you" didn't have a guard but were going up against someone with a similar knife but with a guard then this would place "you" at a disadvantage.

24th October 2006, 05:42 PM	#4
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	Here is a dagger that I have had for a while now but was never quite sure where it was from. At first I thought it was from the Philippines but I'm really not sure anymore. Maybe the experts can say for sure. It is approximently 17 and 1/4" long total. 12-3/4" blade and a 4-3/4" Hilt. It is flat on one side and tapered on the other. It has a crosswork design on the Blades taper side.The Hilt and pommel are Brass and wood in an octagon configuration with some design work on the guard. It has a sheepskin or goatskin sewn sheath which has shrunk with age but it still fits on the blade. Attached Images

24th October 2006, 05:19 PM	#1
Chris Evans Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Australia Posts: 685	Hi Ian, I chose my words carefully when I said that "That is not a facon, at least in the nowadays regionally and commonly accepted sense of the word" Facon simply means a large knife and all kinds of large and small knives found their way into the hands of Gauchos. Those silver hilted and ornate knives that these days are associated with them are very much a mid to late 19th century phenomena. As well, only the wealthy could afford them - Station owners, their overseers and the like. As you can see it is not possible to say exactly what is a facon, especially what was a facon in the old days. According to some, any knife tucked into the belt of a Gaucho is a facon. However, authorities like Domenech and the late Osornio did make an attempt to standardize the terminology, though Domenech acknowledges that there is always something or another that escapes his definitions. If you care to, you may wish to drop a line to Abel Domenech and find out first hand. He speaks fluent English and has a website (down as I write this, but do a Google later) Be all that as it may, it is certainly a very handsome piece. Cheers Chris