Bringing out an oldy for comment

kai · 20th October 2006, 09:42 PM

Hello Lew,

Quote:

Do you think this was purposely done to provide a perch or a guide for proper for gripping the keris?

I don't think so: The grip pretty much falls into place and is more used to direct the blade rather than holding it (as you know, the pushing is done with the center of the palm - not the fingers).

I'm wondering wether there was any forging done on the blade or just stock removal? (Must have been a pain to do from a fully hardened file!) Maybe a light etch would reveal more about the workmanship?

Could you please also post a close-up of the pesi? Thanks!

Regards,
Kai

Lew · 21st October 2006, 03:49 PM

closeups of both sides. Sorry Kai the hilt is on pretty tight so I am not going to chance damaging it by trying to remove it at this time.

Lew

Rick · 21st October 2006, 04:59 PM

Any sign of folding or pamor on this blade Lew ?

Lew · 21st October 2006, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Any sign of folding or pamor on this blade Lew ?

Rick

There are a few spots that may show some linear pamor but over all the look is a spongey iron appearance you would not see that characteristic if it was made from a file. The ganja shows some lamination but it may have been made from another piece of steel .

Lew

Rick · 21st October 2006, 07:27 PM

Why would the marks be on the keris if it did not start life as a file?
If that isn't a remnant of the cross grooves and points of a file then what could it be ?

A vise ?

Would the scenario proposed in my previous post be doable ?
I am no smith .

Alam Shah · 21st October 2006, 10:05 PM

Lew,

Thanks for the clearer picture.

The blade's diamond cross-section should extend all the way to the base of the blade. In this example, it seems that the thickness is not enough to form the base properly, which is approximately 1/2" or 1.5cm (it does vary).

This is how the base should look like for this type of blade.
(Example, courtesy of BluErf's gallery.

)
http://www.kampungnet.com.sg/modules...view_photo.php

From the first picture, there seems to be no sign of a temper.

Example of a 'visible' tempered blade, (courtesy of BluErf's). A two-toned finish.
http://www.kampungnet.com.sg/modules...view_photo.php

Kind Regards,
Shahrial

BluErf · 22nd October 2006, 07:46 AM

Congrats to Lew for having such a beautiful Keris pandai saras.

I think this is a Pattani keris, judging from the hilt style and the greneng.

I think this is still a 'san-mai' construction keris, with the softer steel outer layers sandwiching a harder steel core. There is a difference in the surface condition (different extent of pitting) of the cutting edge and the central body.

The outer soft steel layer could have been made from a file, in my opinion, because of the cross-hatching on the central portion of the base, and on the high point of the gandik.

Rick · 21st October 2006, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kai

Hello Lew,

I don't think so: The grip pretty much falls into place and is more used to direct the blade rather than holding it (as you know, the pushing is done with the center of the palm - not the fingers).

I'm wondering wether there was any forging done on the blade or just stock removal? (Must have been a pain to do from a fully hardened file!) Maybe a light etch would reveal more about the workmanship?

Could you please also post a close-up of the pesi? Thanks!

Regards,
Kai

Could the file have been anealed to soft ; then have been worked, carved and then retempered / hardened when finished ?

21st October 2006, 03:49 PM	#2
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	closeups of both sides. Sorry Kai the hilt is on pretty tight so I am not going to chance damaging it by trying to remove it at this time. Lew Attached Images

21st October 2006, 10:05 PM	#6
Alam Shah Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,248	More or less... a file beginning... Lew, Thanks for the clearer picture. The blade's diamond cross-section should extend all the way to the base of the blade. In this example, it seems that the thickness is not enough to form the base properly, which is approximately 1/2" or 1.5cm (it does vary). This is how the base should look like for this type of blade. (Example, courtesy of BluErf's gallery. ) http://www.kampungnet.com.sg/modules...view_photo.php From the first picture, there seems to be no sign of a temper. Example of a 'visible' tempered blade, (courtesy of BluErf's). A two-toned finish. http://www.kampungnet.com.sg/modules...view_photo.php Kind Regards, Shahrial Last edited by Alam Shah; 22nd October 2006 at 04:22 AM. Reason: grammar...

21st October 2006, 04:59 PM	#3
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,339	Any sign of folding or pamor on this blade Lew ?

21st October 2006, 07:27 PM	#5
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,339	Why would the marks be on the keris if it did not start life as a file? If that isn't a remnant of the cross grooves and points of a file then what could it be ? A vise ? Would the scenario proposed in my previous post be doable ? I am no smith .

22nd October 2006, 07:46 AM	#7
BluErf Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,180	Congrats to Lew for having such a beautiful Keris pandai saras. I think this is a Pattani keris, judging from the hilt style and the greneng. I think this is still a 'san-mai' construction keris, with the softer steel outer layers sandwiching a harder steel core. There is a difference in the surface condition (different extent of pitting) of the cutting edge and the central body. The outer soft steel layer could have been made from a file, in my opinion, because of the cross-hatching on the central portion of the base, and on the high point of the gandik.