Moro kris mystery

[mross]

Originally Posted by Ian

mross:

The style of this kris suggests work by a non-Moro craftsman. I have a couple of similar "kris" coming from the Bagobo/Kaolo in the Davao City area that were made in imitation of kris but obviously not from the original culture (or at least from a traditional craftsman). The kakatua hilt on this one is also a common form from the same general area.

I suspect second half of 20th C. from the Davao City area.

Ian.

Ian,
I agree not Moro. Could you post some photos of yours? How did you arrive at an age?

[mross]

I have been going over this sword a little more. My wife says I'm like a chicken with it's egg. I must correct myself. There is a definite distal taper. I was very surprised when I finally noticed it. While the craftmanship appears crude there is some thought in this. What I think we know; not Moro most likely from "Bagobo/Kaolo in the Davao City" or "Lumad" unless that is the same thing. My only real question is the age. Seller said 20th C, most estimates here concur. There is a fair amount of black rust on it that makes me think there is some age. I would agree 20th C but early 20th C. that would make it around 100 years or so which would be consistant with the black rust. I currently don't know of any process to artifically create black rust. It is tried alot in Nihonto land but it never looks "right". OK, I think that's enough from me on this.
Can anyone post some pictures of kris from this area?

[Ian]

Originally Posted by mross

Ian,
I agree not Moro. Could you post some photos of yours? How did you arrive at an age?

mross:

I picked up my examples in Manila from a dealer whom I have known for quite some time and have developed an "understanding." He is now quite open about his sources and will tell me where he gets his pieces and there age as best he knows.

I picked up a Bagobo/Kaolo kris (they are part of the group of Lumad tribes -- non-Christian, non-Muslim) from him in a typical Bagobo-adorned scabbard with lots of beads, etc. and he told me these were coming out of Davao City and were made post-1960.

I have also been told that the craftsmen give these kris to kids to wear around the village for a while so that they appear "aged."

Here is a link to a thread on the old UBB Forum which has a couple of examples of Lumad kris: http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001448.html

And here is the Bagobo kris that I picked up in Manila:



Ian.

[mross]

Ian,
Thank you so much for that. It solves the mystery!!!
Mine look like a cross between Bagobo kris (the handle shape is identical) and the Kaulo kris (the blade shape and ganyga) from that old thread. Very cool.

Are any of these swords laminated?

[Ian]

Originally Posted by mross

Ian, ...

Are any of these swords laminated?

I think some of the older Lumad kris blades were laminated, although those may have been converted Moro pieces. The Bagobo certainly made laminated blades for their own traditional weapons, so I think it is likely that at least some of these kris had laminated blades also.

Ian.

[kai]

My example is definitely laminated - I'll try to take pics...

Regards,
Kai

[philkid]

I think it came from me originally. I would also say it is from the bagobo people. I also have one here from the tiboli. It also has a separate gangya but the gangya is made from copper.

[kai]

I also have one here from the tiboli. It also has a separate gangya but the gangya is made from copper.

Pics, pics, pics - pretty please!!!

Regards,
Kai