those mysterious Colichemardes

[Jim McDougall]

This I found in "Small Arms Makers", Col. Robert Gardiner, 1963.

MOST perplexing! This reference shows this mark remarkably like the bushy tail fox of Shotley, but to Austrian maker of Steyr...1620?
This reference seems pretty reliable, so the mysteries of Shotley deepen. This is the ONLY time I have seen the BTF in this sort of context, and wish there was some note on how or where it was found.
Steyr in upper Austria was center of many conflicts during Thirty Years War when it was under rule of Duke Maximilian I of Bavaria, and the Peasant War of Upper Austria in 1626 took place, There was a tradition of arms making in later years there, and wonder if Oleys might have had any connection?
It is an intriguing thought.....I had always thought the bushy tail fox was sort of a parody of the Solingen running wolf, but perhaps Oleys had these kinds of connections ?

Though digressing from the topic, these markings have been curious as long as we've discussed Shotley.

In "The Catalog of the Sword Collection at York Castle Museum", P.R. Newman 1985:
CA833 (p.51) is an English hanger of Hounslow type hilt with blade marked with a 'RUNNING HORSE' ?
CA822 (p.49) another hanger of Hounslow type with blade marked with 'RUNNING DOG'? with letter H incorporated.....suggestion made for a 'Birmingham maker, Harvey'? Obviously this refers to Samuel Harvey of Birmingham, but he was much later, mid 18th c. with SH within the figure not just H.

[urbanspaceman]

It is mysterious Jim. Such an elaborate rendering of the Passau Wolf is entirely possible on an expensive blade down in Austria at that time. I will keep looking, because the fact that an almost identical rendering was used on a 1760s colichemarde suggests it may not be entirely alone.
ps
The talismanics are typical of Passau blades back in the 1620s; not just Solingen.

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by urbanspaceman

It is mysterious Jim. Such an elaborate rendering of the Passau Wolf is entirely possible on an expensive blade down in Austria at that time. I will keep looking, because the fact that an almost identical rendering was used on a 1760s colichemarde suggests it may not be entirely alone.
ps
The talismanics are typical of Passau blades back in the 1620s; not just Solingen.

Such are the mysteries of arms! Gardiner seems reasonably meticulous in his material, so there would seem no reason for this to be inaccurate. To take this to another level, could an Austrian maker from Stehr have been among those fleeing the aftermath of the Thirty Years war into England? Stehr was the center of the Peasants war (1626) trying to overthrow the Bavarian rule, also there were problems with collapse of iron resources.

Tenuous yes, but possible. As you note the talismanic number 1414 was one of the most commonly used in Germany, and ironically often appeared with the 'running wolf' in Solingen. It is tempting to note that Austria in these times was virtually a hotbed of magic and occult influences (East European) which then were absorbed into German contexts.

It would not seem a far stretch for this rendering used in Austria to extend into the shops in Shotley at some point, then adopted by Oley, as noted used by Bewick the artistic engraver.

[Hotspur]

This one from Sweden seems later than the start of hollow trefoil blades

Notes are gone...but iirc, Napoleonic era. I'm thinking it was related to the union with Norway in 1818 and several given by the Swedish king as presentations. Either an old SFI thread or elsewhere. I believe Napoleon had Swedish officers working the cause.

Cheers
GC

[urbanspaceman]

Hello Glen. I am sorry to hear of your malady, you have my sympathy.
Thank-you for joining this thread; this sword strikes me as an anomaly. I don't understand what indicated Scandinavia... but that is to be expected as I am still very much a novice outside of my specialist field. The blade is remarkably similar to the one I posted in my essay - yet a much better quality, so if you don't object I will use your image instead. Thanks again and best wishes for your health.

[urbanspaceman]

deleted.

[Hotspur]

Originally Posted by urbanspaceman

Hello Glen. I am sorry to hear of your malady, you have my sympathy.
Thank-you for joining this thread; this sword strikes me as an anomaly. I don't understand what indicated Scandinavia... but that is to be expected as I am still very much a novice outside of my specialist field. The blade is remarkably similar to the one I posted in my essay - yet a much better quality, so if you don't object I will use your image instead. Thanks again and best wishes for your health.

Please do use the image. As posted, I don't have the notes from another's observations. Even if just looking at the Freemason's symbology, one can't expect it to predate English publicly published formation of the Scottish Rite. The large gadrooned pommel less common later but still around in the early 19th century.

Then another blade/shard actually in my care that is mid, or later 18th century and correlates to blades in the Bashford Dean catalogue. Alsace associated work coexisting with the hollow blades.

Cheers
GC

Remounted as a poingard, recently

[urbanspaceman]

Thanks Glen.