Tulwar hilt and disc pommel.....the reason for their design

[Rick]

I caught a glimpses of a very functional thrust, parries and draw cuts from those vids .
The rest , possibly some elements of positioning for the strike ; most everything else seemed like frosting on the cake .

[katana]

Originally Posted by Rick

I caught a glimpses of a very functional thrust, parries and draw cuts from those vids .
The rest , possibly some elements of positioning for the strike ; most everything else seemed like frosting on the cake .

......or perhaps evasive manoeuvres...

[Rick]

Yes possibly those too ; but the whirling blade business .

[Jens Nordlunde]

My personal opinion is, that when clips like the these are shown, one should write that this is a kind of dance and not how they fought at the time. On the forum there are new as well as old collectors, and the new collectors may not be able to look what is behind these clips – they make take them for real.

[Tim Simmons]

This is most impressive, a beautiful show of sword play. Some of the clips bring to mind the historic axe swing in the lines of the Saxons at Senlac Hill.

The foot work is a little static for a true dance, certainly for actual sport fencing which can at times be an approximation to a duel or fighting swordsmanship. None the less very skillful and the fact that these clips show thier hands are very familiar with the sword says enough.

[Jim McDougall]

While I profess no experience whatsoever in martial arts, I have great admiration and respect for those who seriously practice these disciplines. It would seem to me, as an observer, that these forms and manuevers although gracefully practiced in repetition and apparant stylized choreography, are intended to condition the individual into harmony with the weapon. Clearly, as we have previously discussed, in the heat of battle such rehearsed movements would have no place, and the warrior would not be thinking of following such course. It would seem that unconsciously, however, many of the standard movements may be applied as required and the warrior would be conditioned to carry them through.

Conversely, I cannot help recalling an instance in the narrative of a British cavalryman after the Battle of Balaklava, better known of course for the immortal Charge of the Light Brigade. The trooper was completely incensed because in a combat encounter with a Russian cavalry trooper, the proper sword combat procedures were not followed by the Russian! As I recall he complained that he attacked with a cut 3 or 4 (cannot be certain of the numeric) but the Russian responded with an unexpected cut, out of sequence and "the bloody fool knocked me off my horse!!". It almost sounded as if there had been a referee there he would have announced a foul!!

It seems there are many narratives of battles where the complete uselessness of certain rigid military drills totally out of place in unforeseen circumstances became more liability than asset.

I agree that while certain movies and video clips offer great entertainment, they are less than informative when it comes to actual weapon history. One of my recollections is of a pirate movie (of course c.1680) where one of the pirates is wielding a brass hilted cutlass (uh, a M1860 naval cutlass from the Civil War! .

Best regards,
Jim

[katana]

Here is a link to a page with a history of Gatka.

http://www.warriorsaints.com/article...oryOfGatka.asp

The point of the video links was to show how 'unified' both sword and swordsman were whilst performing slashes, parries etc. To me the use of the 'tight' hilt and large disk pommel is attributable to the style of its use...and not physical reasons such as small hands.....
To me, the 'arcing' style of sword technique requires less movement of the wrist. A lot of the movement, with slashing cuts, seems to eminate from the torso. As it twists, a coordinated surge of power then involves the shoulders, the elbow and then the sword (in that sequence). I suppose another way of explaining it, is this.... If you punch a target in front of you without additional body movement the punch is weak. But a coordinated punch were the body twists in the the same direction (and side) as the punch, intensifies the power considerably.
But, I felt there is a problem with the 'arcing' style, because of the power of the cuts, centrifical forces would cause the sword to, most likely, slip from your grasp. If that was the case I would be force to fit a large pommel....to stop me 'losing' my sword.....the trouble is.... a large pommel would be too heavy and upset the point of balance, making it bottom heavy.... not a good idea with a 'slashing' type sword....unless I make it light and large..........a disc pommel.......This is what I was thinking when I first saw these videos and thats why I posted the thread.
I have e-mail a number of Gatka practioners today and asked them how the Tulwar is held, as yet I have not received any replies, hopefully I will.

Tim I agree with your comment utterly
'the fact that these clips show their hands are very familiar with the sword says enough.'

[LabanTayo]

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

While I profess no experience whatsoever in martial arts, I have great admiration and respect for those who seriously practice these disciplines. It would seem to me, as an observer, that these forms and manuevers although gracefully practiced in repetition and apparant stylized choreography, are intended to condition the individual into harmony with the weapon. Clearly, as we have previously discussed, in the heat of battle such rehearsed movements would have no place, and the warrior would not be thinking of following such course. It would seem that unconsciously, however, many of the standard movements may be applied as required and the warrior would be conditioned to carry them through.

Best regards,
Jim

very well said!