Magnetic weapons

Radharc 59 · 6th May 2006, 04:57 PM

Huh. Peculiar for sure. It may very well be, in knives at least, relative to the heat treatment processes. You mess with the magnetic field, indeed, that's the simplest way to know when a steel is at the correct temperature to quench it, in order to harden the steel. It's called the critical temperature, and when it is reached, the steel undergoes a structural change, as evidenced by the fact that it loses it's attraction to a magnet run along the hot blade. When it's up slightly past 'non-magnetic', depending on the steel, you quench it.

As an aside, I align my quench tank so that the blade is pointed towards magnetic North, and quench them held horizontally, moving them back and forth in a stabbing motion. Some claim that the mag N thing is voodoo, but my blades universally harden up well, with almost no warpage whatsoever. So, it works for me. LOL!

Michael
www.radharcknives.com

katana · 6th May 2006, 09:16 PM

..... just a thought.
It may be interesting to get photos of the 'lines of magnetism' for some of the swords, knives and daggers mentioned in this thread. By placing white paper over the blade (which is placed on a non magnetic background), and then sprinkling iron particles on the paper. Lines of magnetic force will appear, as the iron filings align with the field (magnetic) that surrounds the blade. Assuming the possibility that some of the magnetic properties of the blades were deliberate, it might help to see what patterns are produced and aid ideas as to why this is done.

One other thought is, blood is highly concentrated with iron (in haemoglobin), seeing as most blades were used or designed to 'draw blood' perhaps there’s a connection there.........

Jens Nordlunde · 6th May 2006, 09:31 PM

Hi Katana,
Maybe you should go back to the start and look through the mails - then you will see that it has been done.

Jens

katana · 6th May 2006, 09:37 PM

That'll teach me not to skip through threads, my apologies.

Jens Nordlunde · 6th May 2006, 09:45 PM

Don't worry, I do it now and again as well

.

Jens

Rivkin · 29th May 2006, 09:43 PM

Attached is a numerically simulated magnetization in 15x2cm FeNi sample, rapidly cooled from Curie temperature.

a. The magnetization is parallel to the local direction of the magnetic field, therefore the paper and iron dust would procuce a similar picture if placed on top of this sample.

b. Equilibrium configuration is a result of such things as a competition between exchange and dipole-dipole interactions for a given shape.

c. The loss of precise magnetization is more or less a smooth function of temperature. Since Fe has Curie temperature of about 1000K (700C) it is not that noticable at the room temperature, but becomes an essnetial issue when you heat any sample to 500-600C. Initial magnetization, i.e. whether magnetized or unmagnetized iron has been used, becomes at this point mostly irrelevant.

d. The attached simulation was performed in the absence of external fields. Earth's magnetic field is truly irrelevant since it is extremely small; on the other hand the presence of other magnets like magnetized anvil and so on could have made the magnetization to be more uniform.

Rivkin · 19th September 2006, 01:00 AM

Richard Burton in his "book of the sword" tells us that ancient greeks believed magnets to posess healing properties and weapons, made from magnets to be extremely deadly.

6th May 2006, 04:57 PM	#1
Radharc 59 Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 11	Magnetism and knives Huh. Peculiar for sure. It may very well be, in knives at least, relative to the heat treatment processes. You mess with the magnetic field, indeed, that's the simplest way to know when a steel is at the correct temperature to quench it, in order to harden the steel. It's called the critical temperature, and when it is reached, the steel undergoes a structural change, as evidenced by the fact that it loses it's attraction to a magnet run along the hot blade. When it's up slightly past 'non-magnetic', depending on the steel, you quench it. As an aside, I align my quench tank so that the blade is pointed towards magnetic North, and quench them held horizontally, moving them back and forth in a stabbing motion. Some claim that the mag N thing is voodoo, but my blades universally harden up well, with almost no warpage whatsoever. So, it works for me. LOL! Michael www.radharcknives.com

6th May 2006, 09:45 PM	#5
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Don't worry, I do it now and again as well. Jens

29th May 2006, 09:43 PM	#6
Rivkin Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 655	Attached is a numerically simulated magnetization in 15x2cm FeNi sample, rapidly cooled from Curie temperature. a. The magnetization is parallel to the local direction of the magnetic field, therefore the paper and iron dust would procuce a similar picture if placed on top of this sample. b. Equilibrium configuration is a result of such things as a competition between exchange and dipole-dipole interactions for a given shape. c. The loss of precise magnetization is more or less a smooth function of temperature. Since Fe has Curie temperature of about 1000K (700C) it is not that noticable at the room temperature, but becomes an essnetial issue when you heat any sample to 500-600C. Initial magnetization, i.e. whether magnetized or unmagnetized iron has been used, becomes at this point mostly irrelevant. d. The attached simulation was performed in the absence of external fields. Earth's magnetic field is truly irrelevant since it is extremely small; on the other hand the presence of other magnets like magnetized anvil and so on could have made the magnetization to be more uniform. Attached Images

6th May 2006, 09:16 PM	#2
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	..... just a thought. It may be interesting to get photos of the 'lines of magnetism' for some of the swords, knives and daggers mentioned in this thread. By placing white paper over the blade (which is placed on a non magnetic background), and then sprinkling iron particles on the paper. Lines of magnetic force will appear, as the iron filings align with the field (magnetic) that surrounds the blade. Assuming the possibility that some of the magnetic properties of the blades were deliberate, it might help to see what patterns are produced and aid ideas as to why this is done. One other thought is, blood is highly concentrated with iron (in haemoglobin), seeing as most blades were used or designed to 'draw blood' perhaps there’s a connection there.........

6th May 2006, 09:31 PM	#3
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Hi Katana, Maybe you should go back to the start and look through the mails - then you will see that it has been done. Jens

6th May 2006, 09:37 PM	#4
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	That'll teach me not to skip through threads, my apologies.

19th September 2006, 01:00 AM	#7
Rivkin Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 655	Richard Burton in his "book of the sword" tells us that ancient greeks believed magnets to posess healing properties and weapons, made from magnets to be extremely deadly.