At last ... a blunderbuss with a bronze barrel

[Philip]

Originally Posted by corrado26

The safety catch at the Hessian and the Austrian pistol have to be activated by hand but fell off by their weight when the cocks were pulled back into the firing position.

Thank you, Udo, for alerting me to an interesting point. In looking at your images again I see that these catches have what appear to me a stud to help the fingers engage the device, and they are in general of a sufficient shape and mass which allow gravity to disengage them while the weapon is being fully cocked. So, a semi-automatic safety of sorts -- manual activation, but self-disengagement.

In this important respect they differ from the Portuguese version, which is simply a small pivoting "wing" whose edge engages the foot of the cock. Its design does not appear to utilize gravity to disengage during cocking; on the two examples that I have, which are on good-quality Liège-made Portuguese locks in unused condition, the action of these devices is quite stiff due to tight manufacturing tolerances. If the pivot becomes sufficiently loose through normal use and wear, the brake could conceivably swing away during cocking if the muzzle of the gun were pointed downward during the process, but to me this would be a chancy and clumsy procedure.

(for convenience I attach an image again below)

The design seen on your Hessian and Austrian locks appears to be a lot more sophisticated than either the Portuguese brake or the early dog locks, and I can now understand the rationale behind the revival of the concept, at least for some cavalry weapons.

[Fernando K]

Dear Fernando

Glup.............................................. .........

[fernando]

Originally Posted by Fernando K

Dear Fernando

Glup.............................................. .........

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[rickystl]

Hi Fernando

WOW!! CONGRATULATIONS !! What a wonderful piece. That has to be one of the most interesting blunderbuss I have ever seen. Talk about a hybrid ! LOL
I too have never seen even a typical Spanish miquelet lock - much less a Portuguese lock - with a brass lock plate. You usually only see a brass lock plate on higher end English/other European guns. But the detailed quality of this piece certainly qualifies in that category. The carving and engraving are wonderful.
As you note, the English style butt stock and plate are very unusual for a shoulder arm coming from this Region. Also, as you note, the slight cast-off of the butt stock, usually reserved for longer barrel fowlers/rifles to assist the shooter while pointing/aiming. But I can't imagine the cast-off being an advantage for a blunderbuss. Hmmmm.
Another thing I notice is the trigger itself. While obviously functional, it appears rather plain compared to the rest of the gun.
Anyway, again, congratulations. What a great addition to your collection.

Rick

[rickystl]

External Lock Safeties: The external dog style safety behind the hammer seems to have appeared around the Mid-17th Century - at least on English locks. On locks from that period, it was the only means of a safety as the tumblers on vertical sears had only one firing notch or one slot hole in the case of horizontal sears (ala snaphaunce). By the last quarter of the 17th Century, with the wider use of the true French style flintlock with the second safety notch on the tumbler, these dog style safeties started to disappear. Apparently they were simply considered unnecessary by this time. Although you do occasionally see a specimen from the late 17th to early 18th Century with the dog catch used as a secondary safety. But these show up on sporting/private contract style guns.
However, as Corrado mentions, the use of the dog style catch as a secondary safety persisted well into the percussion era in the Hessian/Austrian/Dutch Regions. I've always thought this curious.
The swivel style safety in front of the hammer seems to be a unique feature to Portuguese style locks. Acts as a secondary safety while engaged, and a hammer stop when disengaged. Actually a clever idea. But it would take an extra movement to disengage while the dog style would automatically disengage when the hammer is pulled back into firing position.
Then, sometime about the end of the first quarter of the 18th Century the external safety re-appeared on some sporting/private contract type guns. This time in the form of a sliding secondary safety. Apparently, this sliding safety was deemed useful enough the the British military included this, and other features in their last flintlock officially produced. The photo shows this exact lock dated 1835, and includes the sliding safety, internal frizzen spring, and semi-waterproof pan. An attempt to include all the latest and best features. However, this period also was the beginning surge into the percussion period. So this very late period flintlock never saw much use. In fact many were never even mounted to guns and quickly became surplus. That is why you can often find these locks available today in pristine mechanical condition like this one.
Anyway, it's interesting these external safeties were in use back and forth for some 200+ years.

Rick

[fernando]

Rick, much obliged for the kind words .
... And, no sir; you don't need an extra movement to disengage the safety device. The hammer 'round' foot is designed in a way that, while having an insertion to hold the safety device in half cock position, is also built in a manner that pushes it off, when you roll it around and up to full cock position.
... If i make myself understood.


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[rickystl]

Hi Fernando

OK. Yes I now understand. I did not know this. Thanks. Is the safety on the lock in the photo the only safety ? Or does it act as a secondary device ?

Rick

[Philip]

Originally Posted by rickystl

Hi Fernando

OK. Yes I now understand. I did not know this. Thanks. Is the safety on the lock in the photo the only safety ? Or does it act as a secondary device ?

Rick

Hey Rick, thanks much for your explanation of dog catch history and introducing the sliding safety concept to add context to our discussion.

Here are the three different detached locks that I got last year in that German auction, A is the "three screw" hybrid, B is the so-called "half Portuguese, half French" style, and C is the "knot lock". Note that all three use the interior workings of the French flintlock. But only B has a tumbler with half- and full cock detents -- thoroughly French mechanicals albeit with Portuguese stylistic flourishes on the cock and frizzen spring design. A and C have one-notch tumblers, with the external brake serving as the only safety.

Given the Portuguese love of combining mechanical and stylistic features, I wouldn't be surprised if Nando or another forumite has a gun with one of the above lock types combining both a brake and a half-cock notch. A custom job for a sportsman who wanted a doubly safe lock on his gun. What I show here appear to be production items, likely made in Liège for export to Portugal's colonies.

[fernando]

Originally Posted by rickystl

...OK. Yes I now understand. I did not know this. Thanks. Is the safety on the lock in the photo the only safety ? Or does it act as a secondary device ?...

No Rick; primary ... and sole !

[Philip]

Originally Posted by fernando

Rick, much obliged for the kind words .
... And, no sir; you don't need an extra movement to disengage the safety device. The hammer 'round' foot is designed in a way that, while having an insertion to hold the safety device in half cock position, is also built in a manner that pushes it off, when you roll it around and up to full cock position.
... If i make myself understood.


.

Obrigado, Nando. I examined my locks again, and what you say has opened my eyes to what I had wondered about but didn't understand at first. There is a subtle bit of mechanical engineering that enables the effect that you describe. The três parafusos lock A and the fecho meio à portuguesa e meio à franzesa B in the images previous have the cock base shaped with a little projecting "tongue" below the safety engagement notch -- As the cock is pulled back fully to arm the mechanism, the rotating base makes this tongue push the brake out of the way, allowing the cock to travel its full arc to contact the frizzen. Ingenious!

What we have here is what mechanics call a "cam", and there is prior application in the case of wheellocks, whereby a cam turned by the rotating wheel spindle pushes the pan-cover activating arm forward on its pivot to open the pan and expose the priming powder.

I am now a lot more enthusiastic about the Portuguese brake than i was before now. Whether this will grow into Daehnhardtian exuberance depends on whether I can get used to the idea of using two hands to activate a safety mechanism, as opposed to the convenience of half-cock.

[fernando]

Originally Posted by Philip

... I am now a lot more enthusiastic about the Portuguese brake than i was before now...

Adding to that, the fact that the disengagement is mechanically (self) operated and does not depend on gravity odds like in the dog lock ... am i right ?

Originally Posted by Philip

... Whether this will grow into Daehnhardtian exuberance depends on whether I can get used to the idea of using two hands to activate a safety mechanism, as opposed to the convenience of half-cock.

If i get your point ... can't you do that with two fingers (thumb & index) of the same hand ?