Significance of Beaded Edges/Borders on South Indian Weapons?

Jim McDougall · 11th March 2019, 05:31 PM

I think the architectural connections to edged weapon hilts in Hindu instances are indeed heavily connected, as well explained through many examples in Robert Elgood's "Hindu Arms & Ritual" (2004) and often discussed here over the years. Naturally the Hindu and Buddhist Faiths were in many circumstances syncretically aligned in degree, and the material culture often carried influences of their traditions and symbolism.

The Mughal arts, while deeply inspired by Persian verse and styles also seem to have often adopted of course elements of the Hindu and Buddhist artistic manner in degree. As noted, while Mughal architecture in India was certainly present , it does not seem necessarily prevalent in these kinds of decoration.

It does seem however that in the tulwar hilt, the flueret terminals of Deccani forms seem to reflect Muslim character, as do the distinctive langet style which have been suggested to resemble architectural elements such as the Mighrab. In other instances Muslim hilts pommels are sometimes believed to reflect the domes of Minarets.

While not necessarily relevent here of course, these suggestions and examples of Muslim architectural presence in hilts are simply noted as references in consideration. As Ibrahiim and Mercenary have both noted, Muslim/Mughal architecture I agree does not seem to be our influence source here.

Emphatically, the beads do seem to come from influences in other material culture and great examples shown here in textiles and especially jewellery.
I think one of the key references Jens has long used in the study of hilt designs and decoration is one on Indian jewellery (I cannot think of the title).

Jewellers have long been the artisans creating hilt decoration, regardless of culture and this has been the case into recent and modern times. They are the metalworkers skilled in the often flamboyant and detailed designs and application of precious stones etc. as well as inscribing, engraving and precious metal inlay.

It stands to reason that jewellery would provide influences and inspiration for many forms of decoration on hilts, the beading notwithstanding. While of course some sort of 'beading' might be found architecturally, I would think its influence subordinate to that of jewellery in this case.

On that note, personally I don't think of beading and crenellation in the same context in that crenellation is distinctly architectural, specifically in fortification design (in purpose) but often followed otherwise in design but in other architecture. It would not be used in the delicate manner of beading in my opinion.

ariel · 11th March 2019, 05:49 PM

Agree. Architecture is a dead end in the search for the origin of beading: no connection to jewelry in all its applications.

We are left with two possibilities:
1. Beading was just a " prettyfying" design, devoid of any deep significance.
2. Beading has deep sacral meaning. Proponents of this theory should find primary sources supporting this hypothesis.

mross · 11th March 2019, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ariel

Agree. Architecture is a dead end in the search for the origin of beading: no connection to jewelry in all its applications.

We are left with two possibilities:
1. Beading was just a " prettyfying" design, devoid of any deep significance.
2. Beading has deep sacral meaning. Proponents of this theory should find primary sources supporting this hypothesis.

I'm going with #1. Simplest reason is usually the best.

Mercenary · 11th March 2019, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mross

I'm going with #1. Simplest reason is usually the best.

The simplest reason for whom? For an atheist of the 21th century?

Jim McDougall · 11th March 2019, 08:52 PM

Actually 'Occams Razor' typically does prevail in most investigative cases, but not all of course. It does remarkably depend on the character and values of the investigation, and in reality in these kinds of cases it is difficult to classify subjective meanings to a particular decoration or symbol.

It becomes very much a 'Rorschach' test in a sense as different ideas will be the perceptions of different people. I think here we are seeking any possible or likely value or tradition which might apply to beaded decoration in South India.

I don't think that such views are in any way irreverent as expressed, and what is meant is that as often expressed, often decoration is applied aesthetically and perhaps may recall certain reverent or auspicious features. I think this is actually a respectful expression of a highly regarded element or form intended to enhance.

11th March 2019, 05:31 PM	#1
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,590	I think the architectural connections to edged weapon hilts in Hindu instances are indeed heavily connected, as well explained through many examples in Robert Elgood's "Hindu Arms & Ritual" (2004) and often discussed here over the years. Naturally the Hindu and Buddhist Faiths were in many circumstances syncretically aligned in degree, and the material culture often carried influences of their traditions and symbolism. The Mughal arts, while deeply inspired by Persian verse and styles also seem to have often adopted of course elements of the Hindu and Buddhist artistic manner in degree. As noted, while Mughal architecture in India was certainly present , it does not seem necessarily prevalent in these kinds of decoration. It does seem however that in the tulwar hilt, the flueret terminals of Deccani forms seem to reflect Muslim character, as do the distinctive langet style which have been suggested to resemble architectural elements such as the Mighrab. In other instances Muslim hilts pommels are sometimes believed to reflect the domes of Minarets. While not necessarily relevent here of course, these suggestions and examples of Muslim architectural presence in hilts are simply noted as references in consideration. As Ibrahiim and Mercenary have both noted, Muslim/Mughal architecture I agree does not seem to be our influence source here. Emphatically, the beads do seem to come from influences in other material culture and great examples shown here in textiles and especially jewellery. I think one of the key references Jens has long used in the study of hilt designs and decoration is one on Indian jewellery (I cannot think of the title). Jewellers have long been the artisans creating hilt decoration, regardless of culture and this has been the case into recent and modern times. They are the metalworkers skilled in the often flamboyant and detailed designs and application of precious stones etc. as well as inscribing, engraving and precious metal inlay. It stands to reason that jewellery would provide influences and inspiration for many forms of decoration on hilts, the beading notwithstanding. While of course some sort of 'beading' might be found architecturally, I would think its influence subordinate to that of jewellery in this case. On that note, personally I don't think of beading and crenellation in the same context in that crenellation is distinctly architectural, specifically in fortification design (in purpose) but often followed otherwise in design but in other architecture. It would not be used in the delicate manner of beading in my opinion.

11th March 2019, 05:49 PM	#2
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Agree. Architecture is a dead end in the search for the origin of beading: no connection to jewelry in all its applications. We are left with two possibilities: 1. Beading was just a " prettyfying" design, devoid of any deep significance. 2. Beading has deep sacral meaning. Proponents of this theory should find primary sources supporting this hypothesis.

11th March 2019, 08:52 PM	#5
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,590	Actually 'Occams Razor' typically does prevail in most investigative cases, but not all of course. It does remarkably depend on the character and values of the investigation, and in reality in these kinds of cases it is difficult to classify subjective meanings to a particular decoration or symbol. It becomes very much a 'Rorschach' test in a sense as different ideas will be the perceptions of different people. I think here we are seeking any possible or likely value or tradition which might apply to beaded decoration in South India. I don't think that such views are in any way irreverent as expressed, and what is meant is that as often expressed, often decoration is applied aesthetically and perhaps may recall certain reverent or auspicious features. I think this is actually a respectful expression of a highly regarded element or form intended to enhance.