Ancient Keris Cengkrong for comment

[David]

Originally Posted by Arjuna

Cundrik not Cengkrong.

Perhaps you could explain the difference for us Ajuna. I certainly see numerous blades just like this currently being offered up from Indonesian sources that refer to this type of blade as "Cengkrong".
I have also seen this style of blade referred to as "Cundrik", but Cundrik has also been used by numerous writers on keris (perhaps incorrectly) to describe this a ancient blade form.

[Jean]

Originally Posted by David

Perhaps you could explain the difference for us Ajuna. I certainly see numerous blades just like this currently being offered up from Indonesian sources that refer to this type of blade as "Cengkrong".
I have also seen this style of blade referred to as "Cundrik", but Cundrik has also been used by numerous writers on keris (perhaps incorrectly) to describe this a ancient blade form.

Hello David,
Your blade is a cundrik sajen.
According to the books Dhapur and the EK, the differences between dapur cundrik and cengkrong are very minimal so they can be easily confused. They are usually straight blades but wavy blades are also found, especially with 5 luk.
Regards

[Arjuna]

Originally Posted by David

Perhaps you could explain the difference for us Ajuna. I certainly see numerous blades just like this currently being offered up from Indonesian sources that refer to this type of blade as "Cengkrong".
I have also seen this style of blade referred to as "Cundrik", but Cundrik has also been used by numerous writers on keris (perhaps incorrectly) to describe this a ancient blade form.

I am sorry, cant tell the difference they look almost the same for me. Here are the pictures I found, maybe you know them already ...

Maybe the lurus ones have a reverse Ganja the pandawa none?
I was also told that this is a very old form of keris to be worn by warriors only.

Regards

[David]

Well, if were were to accept this last diagram as fact Arjuna i suppose that your blade would best be described as Cundrik Pandawa since it is both wavy and has no separate gonjo as the other two example do.
Though i am still suspicious of this blade in regards to my question i first made about it. This appears to a a blade that was has been reformed. The front edge near the base looks like it has been sheared off, leaving a flat surface. Can we see some sharper photos of this area of the blade? Can we see the way it fits into the sheath from an above view. Should we expect a Javanese blade form purported to possibly be from a royal family to carry a Madurese hilt form? I suspect this could possibly be a composite piece.

[Arjuna]

Originally Posted by David

Well, if were were to accept this last diagram as fact Arjuna i suppose that your blade would best be described as Cundrik Pandawa since it is both wavy and has no separate gonjo as the other two example do.
Though i am still suspicious of this blade in regards to my question i first made about it. This appears to a a blade that was has been reformed. The front edge near the base looks like it has been sheared off, leaving a flat surface. Can we see some sharper photos of this area of the blade? Can we see the way it fits into the sheath from an above view. Should we expect a Javanese blade form purported to possibly be from a royal family to carry a Madurese hilt form? I suspect this could possibly be a composite piece.

I passed it on to my indonesian friend who desperately wanted it so I can make no more pictures. The Warangka was made for this keris with a fitting opening.

Regards

[Jean]

Another old cengkrong or cundrik blade with 5 luk and rather similar to Arjuna's specimen.
Regards

[Athanase]

I have an almost similar blade, but the hilt and scabbard are recent.

[David]

So no one wants to address my question about the squared-off nature of the "gandik" area of this blade?