First posting/ Opinion asked, Possibly Execution tool?

Newbie Grandpa · 18th February 2018, 05:57 AM

Top of the Pommel? ( is that is the correct word )

Lee · 18th February 2018, 12:06 PM

I suspect this may indeed be an antique that has been aggressively cleaned and so I would not pass it along anywhere for just a 'nominal' amount. Eighteenth / nineteenth century seem reasonable as noted by others above. The steel is a little too defect free to try and argue for much earlier, but the Turk's head of the grip appears very well done and with wear and patina in the seams.

In my very early collecting days I had a rather renowned gun dealer denounce an espada ancha I had acquired as a modern made-up piece and my own general library book level research seemed to confirm this. Fortunately I kept it as years later - in the same dealer's shop! - I found a book that made clear that it was the real deal and something to keep.

broadaxe · 26th February 2018, 12:02 PM

A general statement: lots of these have, surprisingly, popped out in the market along the last 3-2 years. I had a chance to examine two different swords firsthand and I don't have a definitive decision. They appear well made, good weight & balance, nice patina. But the large relative amount of them makes me wonder.

Those of you who sign with Facebook or Google+ may want to read my earlier article on such sword, here (I have some other papers there):
https://www.academia.edu/26655980/A_...Justice_indeed

Helleri · 1st March 2018, 08:31 PM

Is the pommel threaded on (looks peened but maybe not); And if so can we get pics of the threading?

Newbie Grandpa · 2nd March 2018, 02:44 PM

I dont dare try try to take it to parts, because I think that " grip " or hadle part would fell apart + I dont know how to do it. Maybe with large blumbers tools.

Anyway , here is some photos of end part. I suppose that it is not thread, or at least end part some way "feels" like it would be forged or hammered, to attach end of blade to it. I could not see if tiny coffee bean side last round part is part of pommel, or separate part

Helleri · 3rd March 2018, 12:24 AM

Doesn't really look like that pommel is peened on. Looks more capped to me. Like the actual tang of the blade is peened under it. That's some fairly decent wire work as well on the handle. Balded as well which likely means it was handled a lot in my estimation.

corrado26 · 3rd March 2018, 05:29 PM

During a spring auction 2015 of a German auction house a sword of justice in the style of 17th/18th century has been sold. The hilt of it is in my eyes very similar to the piece in question.
corrado26

18th February 2018, 05:57 AM	#1
Newbie Grandpa Member Join Date: Nov 2017 Posts: 6	Oh, forgot this one Top of the Pommel? ( is that is the correct word ) Attached Images

1st March 2018, 08:31 PM	#4
Helleri Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Chino, CA. Posts: 219	Is the pommel threaded on (looks peened but maybe not); And if so can we get pics of the threading? Last edited by Helleri; 1st March 2018 at 11:03 PM.

2nd March 2018, 02:44 PM	#5
Newbie Grandpa Member Join Date: Nov 2017 Posts: 6	Pommel photos I dont dare try try to take it to parts, because I think that " grip " or hadle part would fell apart + I dont know how to do it. Maybe with large blumbers tools. Anyway , here is some photos of end part. I suppose that it is not thread, or at least end part some way "feels" like it would be forged or hammered, to attach end of blade to it. I could not see if tiny coffee bean side last round part is part of pommel, or separate part Attached Images

3rd March 2018, 05:29 PM	#7
corrado26 Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Black Forest, Germany Posts: 1,231	During a spring auction 2015 of a German auction house a sword of justice in the style of 17th/18th century has been sold. The hilt of it is in my eyes very similar to the piece in question. corrado26 Attached Images

18th February 2018, 12:06 PM	#2
Lee EAAF Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Upstate New York, USA Posts: 937	I suspect this may indeed be an antique that has been aggressively cleaned and so I would not pass it along anywhere for just a 'nominal' amount. Eighteenth / nineteenth century seem reasonable as noted by others above. The steel is a little too defect free to try and argue for much earlier, but the Turk's head of the grip appears very well done and with wear and patina in the seams. In my very early collecting days I had a rather renowned gun dealer denounce an espada ancha I had acquired as a modern made-up piece and my own general library book level research seemed to confirm this. Fortunately I kept it as years later - in the same dealer's shop! - I found a book that made clear that it was the real deal and something to keep.

26th February 2018, 12:02 PM	#3
broadaxe Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 334	A general statement: lots of these have, surprisingly, popped out in the market along the last 3-2 years. I had a chance to examine two different swords firsthand and I don't have a definitive decision. They appear well made, good weight & balance, nice patina. But the large relative amount of them makes me wonder. Those of you who sign with Facebook or Google+ may want to read my earlier article on such sword, here (I have some other papers there): https://www.academia.edu/26655980/A_...Justice_indeed

3rd March 2018, 12:24 AM	#6
Helleri Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Chino, CA. Posts: 219	Doesn't really look like that pommel is peened on. Looks more capped to me. Like the actual tang of the blade is peened under it. That's some fairly decent wire work as well on the handle. Balded as well which likely means it was handled a lot in my estimation.