Keris - for Tourists?

Naga Basuki · 18th January 2005, 10:54 PM

I got one of these also, more like the first keris than Eric's. I thought that it was a made-for-tourist joke, but I showed it to a guy who knows keris and he said that he thought mine was a legitimate keris that had been "customized" by a Batak or Dyak. The colors on my paint are a bit more faded, but it does have the boar's teeth and hair.

My wife loves it and has it hanging in the kitchen.

Rick · 19th January 2005, 12:21 AM

Do you think that the wrongko has been re-carved ?

Naga Sasra · 19th January 2005, 04:44 AM

Hi Rick,
I do not believe the wrongko has been re-carved, everything on the piece is consistant with the arrival date to Scandinavia.

I have not re-touched it in any way, all I did when I got it back in the sixties was to clean the blade (which was rather rusty) and preserve it, everything else I left alone.

The gandar have old repairs, it was broken in two places in the middle and a part of the top is missing, but I do think it is original despite the early repairs.

Best Regards, Naga Sasra

Rick · 20th January 2005, 08:35 PM

I noticed that the wrongko of Klaus' example appears to be re-carved .
I wonder what esteem the Dyaks held for these keris , symbolic , or just a dagger ?

Henk · 20th January 2005, 09:05 PM

Naga Sasra,

This is more what I mean. The colors of your keris are not so shiny and the crochet ornaments are typical too for this keris.
This type of keris is present in the national museum of ethnology in Leiden, Holland. The paint however is much more faded. If this one arrived in the early 20th century in Scandinavia it is very well preserved and certainly not a tourist item. Also the keris itself looks to be in a good condition.

Naga Basuki, I would like to see some pictures of your keris. Please post them, so that we can have a look.

Rick, these kerisses don't come from the dayak but from the papoea of Irian Jaya. I think that they considered the blade as just a dagger. How these tribes thought about these items, I must admit that I don't know. But they were very primitive, so I think they didn't apreciate keris the way keris should be apreciated. On the other hand they were also familiar with the mandau so there could be some trade with the dayak. But it is more likely that some papoea's lost their head during these meetings.

Rick · 20th January 2005, 09:50 PM

Thanks Henk .
I wonder if these old indonesian keris may have been used in trading with the Papoea .

Henk · 21st January 2005, 02:38 PM

That's a good question. We have several options. It is possible that during a hunting party the hunters lost something too

. Trading is also a good posibility because the blades are mostly javanese. Sumatra was known for trading throughout the archipello. And javanese blades were highly apreciated on Sumatra. So there was delivery of javanese blades to Sumatra. These blades were used and mounted as Sumatra keris and I can imagine that the surplus was used for trading.

Just some opinions, because i don't know the answer either.

Klaus Albrecht · 21st January 2005, 08:53 PM

Thanks for all informations

klaus

19th January 2005, 12:21 AM	#2
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,339	Naga Sasra Do you think that the wrongko has been re-carved ?

18th January 2005, 10:54 PM	#1
Naga Basuki Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Big old machine shop/foundry/warehouse in Atlanta GA USA Posts: 51	I got one of these also, more like the first keris than Eric's. I thought that it was a made-for-tourist joke, but I showed it to a guy who knows keris and he said that he thought mine was a legitimate keris that had been "customized" by a Batak or Dyak. The colors on my paint are a bit more faded, but it does have the boar's teeth and hair. My wife loves it and has it hanging in the kitchen.

19th January 2005, 04:44 AM	#3
Naga Sasra Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Boca Raton, Florida, USA Posts: 108	Hi Rick, I do not believe the wrongko has been re-carved, everything on the piece is consistant with the arrival date to Scandinavia. I have not re-touched it in any way, all I did when I got it back in the sixties was to clean the blade (which was rather rusty) and preserve it, everything else I left alone. The gandar have old repairs, it was broken in two places in the middle and a part of the top is missing, but I do think it is original despite the early repairs. Best Regards, Naga Sasra

20th January 2005, 08:35 PM	#4
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,339	I noticed that the wrongko of Klaus' example appears to be re-carved . I wonder what esteem the Dyaks held for these keris , symbolic , or just a dagger ?

20th January 2005, 09:05 PM	#5
Henk Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,209	Naga Sasra, This is more what I mean. The colors of your keris are not so shiny and the crochet ornaments are typical too for this keris. This type of keris is present in the national museum of ethnology in Leiden, Holland. The paint however is much more faded. If this one arrived in the early 20th century in Scandinavia it is very well preserved and certainly not a tourist item. Also the keris itself looks to be in a good condition. Naga Basuki, I would like to see some pictures of your keris. Please post them, so that we can have a look. Rick, these kerisses don't come from the dayak but from the papoea of Irian Jaya. I think that they considered the blade as just a dagger. How these tribes thought about these items, I must admit that I don't know. But they were very primitive, so I think they didn't apreciate keris the way keris should be apreciated. On the other hand they were also familiar with the mandau so there could be some trade with the dayak. But it is more likely that some papoea's lost their head during these meetings.

20th January 2005, 09:50 PM	#6
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,339	Thanks Henk . I wonder if these old indonesian keris may have been used in trading with the Papoea .

21st January 2005, 02:38 PM	#7
Henk Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,209	That's a good question. We have several options. It is possible that during a hunting party the hunters lost something too . Trading is also a good posibility because the blades are mostly javanese. Sumatra was known for trading throughout the archipello. And javanese blades were highly apreciated on Sumatra. So there was delivery of javanese blades to Sumatra. These blades were used and mounted as Sumatra keris and I can imagine that the surplus was used for trading. Just some opinions, because i don't know the answer either.

21st January 2005, 08:53 PM	#8
Klaus Albrecht Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Austria Posts: 8	Thanks for all informations klaus