Koummya with nice(?) blade

Sajen · 3rd August 2017, 11:15 PM

For me, and I am not an expert by this sort of daggers, is the first one the real deal. Look to the worn holes for the carrying strip, this dagger was long time in use, so also the blade for real use and the worn and (tribal) repaired scabbard. I would choose the first one!

Regards,
Detlef

Kubur · 4th August 2017, 09:19 AM

If you want some brights comments, you should use a flash!

motan · 4th August 2017, 12:47 PM

Hi Detlef,
I think the blade IS good, but probably foreign made, because of the a-typical bevels. Usually, sides have an unsharpened edge of different lengths: long on convex side and short on the concave side. In yours, the bevels start at the same place, but there is an additional one on the convex side. The forte looks very European-like in a straight hunting dagger.
The scabbard and hilt look like they have been of good quality, but are worn beyond recognition. So, besides the poor condition of the outer part, it probably IS or at least was a good and old dagger.
This assymetry in all koummyas is food for thought. I do not know how curved daggers were used in general, but both sides are usually sharpened in the same way. So, both sides can be equally used for cutting. In koummyas, it appears that the main edge for cutting is the concave edge. Not only because it is longer, but also because in examples where the blade is deformed by re-sharpening, it is the inner edge that has been mostly re-sharpened. A throat cutter??

motan · 4th August 2017, 12:52 PM

Hi Shayde78,
I am sorry to say that, but the blade is NOT a good blade and the whole is typical of a koummya made for the tourist trade.
Keep looking and read references in the forum for some good examples.

Sajen · 4th August 2017, 03:45 PM

Hi Eytan,

I think you mixed up here something, both Koummya belong to shayde78, I only commented with my limited knowledge.

But you seems to confirm what I've said. And yes, I think also that the first dagger have a trade blade, like Kubur I would like to see better pictures.

And like you I think that the second piece is a so called tourist dagger, cheaply worked with steel sheet blade.

Better pictures would be really helpful.

Regards,
Detlef

Helleri · 4th August 2017, 09:47 PM

Can't hardly see that first blade. I took the image to GIMP and applied contrast mask and some mild sharpening.

motan · 5th August 2017, 01:22 PM

Yes Detlef, I see my mistake. But everything I wrote is still valid, also with the new picture. The silver is soft and what happened to the rings shows it has been carried for many years. Probably a late 19th c. piece.

3rd August 2017, 11:15 PM	#1
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,212	For me, and I am not an expert by this sort of daggers, is the first one the real deal. Look to the worn holes for the carrying strip, this dagger was long time in use, so also the blade for real use and the worn and (tribal) repaired scabbard. I would choose the first one! Regards, Detlef

4th August 2017, 09:19 AM	#2
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	If you want some brights comments, you should use a flash!

4th August 2017, 12:47 PM	#3
motan Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Jerusalem Posts: 274	Hi Detlef, I think the blade IS good, but probably foreign made, because of the a-typical bevels. Usually, sides have an unsharpened edge of different lengths: long on convex side and short on the concave side. In yours, the bevels start at the same place, but there is an additional one on the convex side. The forte looks very European-like in a straight hunting dagger. The scabbard and hilt look like they have been of good quality, but are worn beyond recognition. So, besides the poor condition of the outer part, it probably IS or at least was a good and old dagger. This assymetry in all koummyas is food for thought. I do not know how curved daggers were used in general, but both sides are usually sharpened in the same way. So, both sides can be equally used for cutting. In koummyas, it appears that the main edge for cutting is the concave edge. Not only because it is longer, but also because in examples where the blade is deformed by re-sharpening, it is the inner edge that has been mostly re-sharpened. A throat cutter??

4th August 2017, 12:52 PM	#4
motan Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Jerusalem Posts: 274	Hi Shayde78, I am sorry to say that, but the blade is NOT a good blade and the whole is typical of a koummya made for the tourist trade. Keep looking and read references in the forum for some good examples.

4th August 2017, 03:45 PM	#5
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,212	Hi Eytan, I think you mixed up here something, both Koummya belong to shayde78, I only commented with my limited knowledge. But you seems to confirm what I've said. And yes, I think also that the first dagger have a trade blade, like Kubur I would like to see better pictures. And like you I think that the second piece is a so called tourist dagger, cheaply worked with steel sheet blade. Better pictures would be really helpful. Regards, Detlef

4th August 2017, 09:47 PM	#6
Helleri Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Chino, CA. Posts: 219	Can't hardly see that first blade. I took the image to GIMP and applied contrast mask and some mild sharpening.

5th August 2017, 01:22 PM	#7
motan Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Jerusalem Posts: 274	Yes Detlef, I see my mistake. But everything I wrote is still valid, also with the new picture. The silver is soft and what happened to the rings shows it has been carried for many years. Probably a late 19th c. piece.