Koftgari - genuine vs. fake

rickystl · 20th April 2016, 03:37 PM

Thanks for this Post. Rick.

Battara · 20th April 2016, 04:09 PM

Phillip you bring up a good point. I have an Ottoman kard (bichaq) that has slightly domed koftgari with the cross hatching. Yet my sossoun pata has flat koftgari.

Unless it is Bidri, I think that cross hatching is a great hint for true koftgari, and how "painty" the work appears.

mariusgmioc · 20th April 2016, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

Phillip you bring up a good point. I have an Ottoman kard (bichaq) that has slightly domed koftgari with the cross hatching. Yet my sossoun pata has flat koftgari.

Unless it is Bidri, I think that cross hatching is a great hint for true koftgari, and how "painty" the work appears.

The presence of cross hatching is NOT an indication of genuine Koftgari as paint is also applied on cross hatching to adere to the surface. All the fake Koftgari I have seen was applied on cross hatching.

To my knowledge, fake/painted Koftgari is not very common, but since it is dirt cheap to produce I am pretty sure we will see more of it.

ariel · 20th April 2016, 06:28 PM

Maybe I just do not get it:
OK, they cross-hatched, applied gold paint , and then? They had to wipe off the unneeded paint to preserve thin, uniform, precise lines, right?
How was it done? Scraping off dried gold paint would leave behind uneven lines, no matter what.

Am I missing something?

mariusgmioc · 20th April 2016, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ariel

Maybe I just do not get it:
OK, they cross-hatched, applied gold paint , and then? They had to wipe off the unneeded paint to preserve thin, uniform, precise lines, right?
How was it done? Scraping off dried gold paint would leave behind uneven lines, no matter what.

Am I missing something?

Hello Ariel,

The process is simple:

1. make the cross-hatches so that the paint adheres to the surface
2. with tiny (and I mean really tiny) brushes paint the desired pattern
3. let it dry
4. finished.

Now why would there be unwanted paint to be scraped when it is painted exactly the pattern that is needed (thin, fine and precise)?

It is like painting a miniature work just it is much easier because you have only one colour and the detail is not that small (in miniature painting I have seen artists in Udaipur using brushes with one or two hairs).

However, since the gold paint is rather thick, the precision of the design is not very good. Just have a look at the Tulwar hilt that I mentioned (that I can bet it is painted) and try to imagine yourself painting it with a precise brush and a steady hand.

ariel · 20th April 2016, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mariusgmioc

try to imagine yourself painting it with a precise brush and a steady hand.

What? No sixpack at lunchbreak?

mariusgmioc · 20th April 2016, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ariel

What? No sixpack at lunchbreak?

When I suggested you try to imagine painting the respective Tulwar, I wasn't being sarcastic, but I genuinely meant it as it will help you understand the technique and better judge the end result.

As with regards to the "sixpack at lunchbreak"... the truth is I have no idea what it means as I am not a native speaker.

Jens Nordlunde · 20th April 2016, 04:16 PM

Philip is correct, I am glad to say.
When the kroftgari was done, it was mostly filed down to a flat surface. One theory could be, that it whould not show the cross hatches, likely imitating inlay. However, there are too many old examples that the koftgari gold work was very thick, to say that all thick koftgari gold work it was painted, as it may be to day - although I have not yet seen any hilts with painted koftgari.

20th April 2016, 03:37 PM	#1
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,633	Thanks for this Post. Rick.

20th April 2016, 04:09 PM	#2
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,310	Phillip you bring up a good point. I have an Ottoman kard (bichaq) that has slightly domed koftgari with the cross hatching. Yet my sossoun pata has flat koftgari. Unless it is Bidri, I think that cross hatching is a great hint for true koftgari, and how "painty" the work appears.

20th April 2016, 06:28 PM	#4
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Maybe I just do not get it: OK, they cross-hatched, applied gold paint , and then? They had to wipe off the unneeded paint to preserve thin, uniform, precise lines, right? How was it done? Scraping off dried gold paint would leave behind uneven lines, no matter what. Am I missing something?

20th April 2016, 04:16 PM	#8
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Philip is correct, I am glad to say. When the kroftgari was done, it was mostly filed down to a flat surface. One theory could be, that it whould not show the cross hatches, likely imitating inlay. However, there are too many old examples that the koftgari gold work was very thick, to say that all thick koftgari gold work it was painted, as it may be to day - although I have not yet seen any hilts with painted koftgari.