On the Use of Indian Terms for Identification of Weapon Types

Mercenary · 14th October 2015, 11:17 PM

Jens
I am sorry I was thinking about pictures from Jaipur museum where depicted all of types of weapons that were in Jaipur armory. With their names.
It is a pity that we know nothing about a manuscript with over names of weapons. Science requires openness. I am sorry.

Emanuel · 14th October 2015, 11:49 PM

Hi Mercenary,

My comment was concerning the similarity between the sound of the words. You presented a dissection of phauladi (fulad, pulad) as originating from "phul"-flower. Other researchers dissected it to the roots "pu" "lauha" - purified iron, which is a close description of crucible steel.

On the phul-katara, Elgood includes a few lovely examples in his catalogue of the Jaipur Court. They all have floral hilts. This fits the definition of "phul"-flower.
So phul-katara just refers to a dagger with floral hilt.

Cheers!
Emanuel

Mercenary · 15th October 2015, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emanuel

Hi Mercenary,
Other researchers dissected it to the roots "pu" "lauha" - purified iron, which is a close description of crucible steel.

There is a problem. Neither Jahangir nor Abdul Aziz nor present-day sekligarhs whose grandfathers and great-grandfathers (who worked in the court armories still) never read the articles of "other researchers" or some researchers else or any Internet forums )). They just say "fauladi". That is all.
You know what Indians added to the crucibles with the iron? What was considered as a secret? If you know, then you will understand why a crucible steel was called "flower steel", "fruit steel". It was magic for Indians then.

Mercenary · 15th October 2015, 01:46 PM

Ok. No need to read my article or to study sources or to go to India to learn something. Let's play a game. A small equation with one unknown for primary schools:
[jeweled dagger WITH phull-katara] = [dagger decorated with gems] PLUS [X-blade].
It is known that dagger has gems (in which zone a dagger can has the gems?). And it is known that KATARA is a blade.
JEWELED DAGGER WITH SOME BLADE. And wherein "phul" relates to steel. Well?

Ian · 15th October 2015, 03:08 PM

Mercenary:

I'm having trouble following your comment here. Can you explain please.

Ian.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mercenary

Ok. No need to read my article or to study sources or to go to India to learn something. Let's play a game. A small equation with one unknown for primary schools:
[jeweled dagger WITH phull-katara] = [dagger decorated with gems] PLUS [X-blade].
It is known that dagger has gems (in which zone a dagger can has the gems?). And it is known that KATARA is a blade.
JEWELED DAGGER WITH SOME BLADE. And wherein "phul" relates to steel. Well?

Mercenary · 15th October 2015, 03:19 PM

Dear Ian

I am sorry for confusion. I meant following idea. In context the term "phul-katara" itself was used only once or twice. The most part of cases when it was used are within a sentences as "jeweled dagger WITH phul-katara" or "with costly phul-katara". If you analize the text it becomes clear that "phul-katara" could not be an independent kind of daggers. It refers to the quality of the blade.

15th October 2015, 03:19 PM	#6
Mercenary Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Moscow, Russia Posts: 430	Dear Ian I am sorry for confusion. I meant following idea. In context the term "phul-katara" itself was used only once or twice. The most part of cases when it was used are within a sentences as "jeweled dagger WITH phul-katara" or "with costly phul-katara". If you analize the text it becomes clear that "phul-katara" could not be an independent kind of daggers. It refers to the quality of the blade. Last edited by Mercenary; 15th October 2015 at 03:38 PM.

14th October 2015, 11:17 PM	#1
Mercenary Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Moscow, Russia Posts: 430	Jens I am sorry I was thinking about pictures from Jaipur museum where depicted all of types of weapons that were in Jaipur armory. With their names. It is a pity that we know nothing about a manuscript with over names of weapons. Science requires openness. I am sorry.

14th October 2015, 11:49 PM	#2
Emanuel Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 1,242	Hi Mercenary, My comment was concerning the similarity between the sound of the words. You presented a dissection of phauladi (fulad, pulad) as originating from "phul"-flower. Other researchers dissected it to the roots "pu" "lauha" - purified iron, which is a close description of crucible steel. On the phul-katara, Elgood includes a few lovely examples in his catalogue of the Jaipur Court. They all have floral hilts. This fits the definition of "phul"-flower. So phul-katara just refers to a dagger with floral hilt. Cheers! Emanuel

15th October 2015, 01:46 PM	#4
Mercenary Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Moscow, Russia Posts: 430	Ok. No need to read my article or to study sources or to go to India to learn something. Let's play a game. A small equation with one unknown for primary schools: [jeweled dagger WITH phull-katara] = [dagger decorated with gems] PLUS [X-blade]. It is known that dagger has gems (in which zone a dagger can has the gems?). And it is known that KATARA is a blade. JEWELED DAGGER WITH SOME BLADE. And wherein "phul" relates to steel. Well?