For Kerislovers

kai · 9th November 2005, 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

I am a little surprised that they use "kris" instead of "keris".

That's just the Dutch common name which stuck with these blades. You know that the early seafaring accounts use many different transliterations/corruptions of the local names and the spelling "kris" seems to have been adopted in several European languages, at least during the later parts of the colonial period.

Regards,
Kai

Henk · 9th November 2005, 01:41 PM

In the dutch musea are very nice keris present.

Battara and Kai, It is very simple that we use the word kris instead of keris. When you speak the word keris quickly and not very clear a dutch (and probably not only a dutch) will hear the word keris as kris. In many old dutch book about keris, keris is written as kris. It is very likely the authors heared the word kris and nobody made a correction. When you ask a dutch about kris a lot of them will refer to the Indonesian dagger. When you ask for keris a lot of us will look at you with incomprehension.

BluErf · 9th November 2005, 03:53 PM

Don't seem to see anything when I click on the link. Can't read Dutch too.

Alam Shah · 9th November 2005, 04:14 PM

Blu,

When you see the underscores, type 'kris' and click 'Zeok'.
You'll get a list of related hits...enjoy...

For translations, I copy and paste the text
using Altavista Babel Fish Translations.
It's not perfect but can give an outline of what it means...
http://world.altavista.com/

Of course there are other such as SDL International
Free text translator.
http://www.freetranslation.com/

simatua · 9th November 2005, 06:02 PM

Dear kerislovers,

The webside first mentioned contains photo's and decription from the database
from the "rijksmuseum Volkenkunde"

The database contains over 900 photo's from kerises( with or without text)
look at www.rmv.nl
I am sorry for people cannot read Dutch, because you have to make a choice
in the Home page Nederlands ===> collectie ===> database ===> zelf zoeken (=selfsearch) : KRIS ( not keris).

The Englisch part does not contain all the photo's.

For those who cannot read Dutch: Another language ( like German,Indonesian etc) never kept me away from study and learning from photo's

rahman · 10th November 2005, 12:32 AM

Quote:

I am a little surprised that they use "kris" instead of "keris".

Actually, when you read 19th and early 20th century English/British works the term "creese" was used. People got "creesed" in those days.

nechesh · 10th November 2005, 04:01 AM

Ki and Martin, thanks for the links. Even not knowing Dutch i managed to stumble my way into both data bases. The first link is interesting due to the fact that many are state keris. It is also interesting to note that except for the so called Wllem IV keris all the others weren't collected until the late 19th or early 20th centuries. It is a shame that the site isn't properly managed so that the photos open up at a higher resolution. I can see some of these are very nice keris, but the pixelation makes it very difficult to make much use of them for any serious study.
I'm afraid i found Martin's link even more dissapointing. These are some really bad photos. Most of what i viewed were fairly common piece, many in rust and disrepair, though i must admit i gave up after a few pages. Even so, most of the photos i saw show very bad angles that barely show the blade, some are actually out of focus and these pics also open up badly pixelated. You would think that major museums would domore professional work.

9th November 2005, 04:14 PM	#4
Alam Shah Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,248	Free translation service... Blu, When you see the underscores, type 'kris' and click 'Zeok'. You'll get a list of related hits...enjoy... For translations, I copy and paste the text using Altavista Babel Fish Translations. It's not perfect but can give an outline of what it means... http://world.altavista.com/ Of course there are other such as SDL International Free text translator. http://www.freetranslation.com/

9th November 2005, 06:02 PM	#5
simatua Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 69	another webside Dear kerislovers, The webside first mentioned contains photo's and decription from the database from the "rijksmuseum Volkenkunde" The database contains over 900 photo's from kerises( with or without text) look at www.rmv.nl I am sorry for people cannot read Dutch, because you have to make a choice in the Home page Nederlands ===> collectie ===> database ===> zelf zoeken (=selfsearch) : KRIS ( not keris). The Englisch part does not contain all the photo's. For those who cannot read Dutch: Another language ( like German,Indonesian etc) never kept me away from study and learning from photo's

9th November 2005, 01:41 PM	#2
Henk Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,209	In the dutch musea are very nice keris present. Battara and Kai, It is very simple that we use the word kris instead of keris. When you speak the word keris quickly and not very clear a dutch (and probably not only a dutch) will hear the word keris as kris. In many old dutch book about keris, keris is written as kris. It is very likely the authors heared the word kris and nobody made a correction. When you ask a dutch about kris a lot of them will refer to the Indonesian dagger. When you ask for keris a lot of us will look at you with incomprehension.

9th November 2005, 03:53 PM	#3
BluErf Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,180	Don't seem to see anything when I click on the link. Can't read Dutch too.

10th November 2005, 04:01 AM	#7
nechesh Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 940	Ki and Martin, thanks for the links. Even not knowing Dutch i managed to stumble my way into both data bases. The first link is interesting due to the fact that many are state keris. It is also interesting to note that except for the so called Wllem IV keris all the others weren't collected until the late 19th or early 20th centuries. It is a shame that the site isn't properly managed so that the photos open up at a higher resolution. I can see some of these are very nice keris, but the pixelation makes it very difficult to make much use of them for any serious study. I'm afraid i found Martin's link even more dissapointing. These are some really bad photos. Most of what i viewed were fairly common piece, many in rust and disrepair, though i must admit i gave up after a few pages. Even so, most of the photos i saw show very bad angles that barely show the blade, some are actually out of focus and these pics also open up badly pixelated. You would think that major museums would domore professional work.