highly dressed keris

nechesh · 5th November 2005, 04:59 PM

Thanks for you informative comments T.C. and a very happy Eid to you.

The question on the removal of antiquities is always a tough one. I do understand your concern, but i must agree with Martin to some extent as well. You are, unfortunately, a minority in a nation which becomes more and more "westernized" as global economy takes it's toll on indigenous culture. Many artifacts are indeed rusting into oblivion due to the lack of interest by the present and next generations. Do we watch that happen or make an attempt to save what can be saved. If Martin's new keris were confiscated at the border, where would it have ended up? Would it now be rust-free and restored? Would it be in the hands of someone who loved and treasured it or lying in some draw slowly rusting away?
BTW, i don't think there are really any keris experts here, just enthusiasts and lovers of a dying artform seeking as much knowledge and understanding as we can find in the limited resources available to us.

Mans · 5th November 2005, 06:03 PM

Hi dear all,

Just need to give my opinion about Simatua keris, I think KC is right about old keris out of Indonesia and any other ancient artifact.

.... back to the keris and wangka, The dapur (shape) of Simatua keris not Pandawa, but Pulanggeni. Pandawa has Kembang Kacang at Gandik, but Pulanggeni not. The pamor called Beras Wutah. If I look closer on the iron and pamor, also deep tikel alis and another ricikan (features), this keris can be made from late Majapahit period.

.. and the wrangka, called gayaman Jogja style made from Timoho wooden with mendak meniran Jogjakarta. The hilt also Jogjakarta style. The pendok called Kemalo, more specific.. Black Kemalo from Silver. I suppose that all of the wrangka is old made. Nice wrangka.

but, could you please give a close up picture of the pesi/peksi (bottom of the gonjo) ? I think the pesi of this keris is repaired (Jawa = Srumbungan). So that look not appropriate for the keris from Majapahit keris period. bigger that usually.

Overall.. good keris and classy wrangka.

Warm regards,
Mans.

nechesh · 6th November 2005, 05:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mans

Hi dear all,
Just need to give my opinion about Simatua keris, I think KC is right about old keris out of Indonesia and any other ancient artifact.

Forgive me Mans, but as a dealer of keris don't you regularly export antique keris out of Indonesia.

BluErf · 6th November 2005, 08:51 AM

Shhh... don't ask too many questions!

slovak · 6th November 2005, 10:20 AM

Perhaps the one that is restricted is kerisses that had been verified professionally as an indonesian pusaka. Kerisses for western "menu" is surely different.

Mans · 6th November 2005, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BluErf

Shhh... don't ask too many questions!

Don't ask too many questions ...... just do it as Kai doing so far

As antique artifact, antique keris can't be exported..., but as a traditional steel handycraft for personal collections it can be

and, as Pusaka (family heirloom), I will keep some of my keris for my next generations.

... for western or eastern "menu" I think it same. Now, western knew well about the keris. I realy appreciate that. So, depend to our knowledge about the keris, the seller whose give truth informations and trust. But, if you have good knowldege about it, let your feeling tellling the truth about the good keris which you intersted.

Sorry if any mistake on my English

5th November 2005, 04:59 PM	#1
nechesh Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 940	Thanks for you informative comments T.C. and a very happy Eid to you. The question on the removal of antiquities is always a tough one. I do understand your concern, but i must agree with Martin to some extent as well. You are, unfortunately, a minority in a nation which becomes more and more "westernized" as global economy takes it's toll on indigenous culture. Many artifacts are indeed rusting into oblivion due to the lack of interest by the present and next generations. Do we watch that happen or make an attempt to save what can be saved. If Martin's new keris were confiscated at the border, where would it have ended up? Would it now be rust-free and restored? Would it be in the hands of someone who loved and treasured it or lying in some draw slowly rusting away? BTW, i don't think there are really any keris experts here, just enthusiasts and lovers of a dying artform seeking as much knowledge and understanding as we can find in the limited resources available to us.

5th November 2005, 06:03 PM	#2
Mans Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: East Java Posts: 137	Hi dear all, Just need to give my opinion about Simatua keris, I think KC is right about old keris out of Indonesia and any other ancient artifact. .... back to the keris and wangka, The dapur (shape) of Simatua keris not Pandawa, but Pulanggeni. Pandawa has Kembang Kacang at Gandik, but Pulanggeni not. The pamor called Beras Wutah. If I look closer on the iron and pamor, also deep tikel alis and another ricikan (features), this keris can be made from late Majapahit period. .. and the wrangka, called gayaman Jogja style made from Timoho wooden with mendak meniran Jogjakarta. The hilt also Jogjakarta style. The pendok called Kemalo, more specific.. Black Kemalo from Silver. I suppose that all of the wrangka is old made. Nice wrangka. but, could you please give a close up picture of the pesi/peksi (bottom of the gonjo) ? I think the pesi of this keris is repaired (Jawa = Srumbungan). So that look not appropriate for the keris from Majapahit keris period. bigger that usually. Overall.. good keris and classy wrangka. Warm regards, Mans.

6th November 2005, 08:51 AM	#4
BluErf Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,180	Shhh... don't ask too many questions!

6th November 2005, 10:20 AM	#5
slovak Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 5	Perhaps the one that is restricted is kerisses that had been verified professionally as an indonesian pusaka. Kerisses for western "menu" is surely different.