Bali keris hilt - to glue or thread?

Justin · 12th October 2005, 02:06 PM

I wrap the tangs in some thin cloth,it will hold them securely and its easily removable,I vote for not glueing also.

Henk · 12th October 2005, 07:41 PM

NEVER EVER GLUE AN UKIRAN TO THE PEKSI !!!!!!

Just use some cloth to wind around the peksi and put the ukiran on. Not too tight to prevent the ukiran from breaking or cracking. The ukiran should slide rather easily over the peksi just like turning a screw. Then the ukiran fits perfectly on your keris.

Working so long on your keris and then destroying it by glueing the ukiran on it???

ariel · 12th October 2005, 09:15 PM

Good grief!
I have never seen so many capital letters, exclamation points and horror icons.
You Kris people do get rather emotional, don't you? Smelling salts, anybody? And then, having recovered from vapors, please tell us how you really feel about Krazy Glue.

Henk · 12th October 2005, 10:14 PM

Ariel,

Glueing a keris is simply not done. And why should you? All parts of a keris are replaceable and removeable. When a keris blade is cleaned and re-etched the blade goes into a bath. Having a beautiful ukiran glued on it, is not very smart. The only time you can use glue on a keris is to reglue the gandar to the wrangka.

Don't we want our weapons to be original as they originally are?
The Krazy glue might be good stuff to repair broken parts. And in that case you can use glue on a keris to repair broken parts.

Battara · 12th October 2005, 10:27 PM

If I gather all of your subtle hints together and read between the lines, one might possibly infer that perhaps using cloth/thread is slightly preferable over the use of glue.

Thank you all for your help. I had read somewhere that one used glue, though most of the other references stated cloth or thread. The piece came to me glued in.

It took me a little careful time to get the old glue out to do restoration. So.....cloth/thread it is.

Any perference: cloth or thread or any other advise?

marto suwignyo · 12th October 2005, 11:24 PM

Mr. Battara

In olden times the handles of keris were most often fixed to the pesi with damar. I have read that in pre war Malaya people used melted gramaphone records to fix keris handles in place.

These days, we do sometimes use jabung, which a mixture of damar, wax and ground terracotta, to fix a handle with a short or thin pesi. This can be easily removed if it necessary by gentle application of heat to the sorsoran.

Sometimes hair has been used.

If your keris has a normally strong pesi, and if it Bali keris it probably will have, you should just use a pressure fit, as everybody else has already said.However, rather than use cloth I suggest that you use knitting wool.
Cloth does not compress very well, and if the handle too tight it might split.

nechesh · 13th October 2005, 01:13 AM

Gee Ariel, why don't you tell us what you really think about us "Kris people". I trust this was not meant with any derogatory intention.

No offense taken.

Marto is, of course, right. Other more "fixed" methods of hilt attachment have been used. I had always heard of pitch being used. Is that the same stuff as the damar you mention Marto? Certainly it would make sense that any keris that might end up being used martially would need to have a well adhered handle to be at all useful. But as Marto points out, these other materials used are not nearly as permanent as epoxy of the dreaded

Crazy Glue.

Just heat and gentle manipulation will free the blade.
The keris seems a fairly unique weapon (in many ways really) in that the removal and changability of many of it's parts (hilt, mendak, wrongko) are actually a part of the culture surrounding the blade, whether to signify some reward or added prominence in life or the changing of hands from one owner to the next. And as Henk points out, regular cleansing ceromonies require the blade be removed from the hilt.
Wow, i actually got through this entire post without using a horror icon!

........damn!

12th October 2005, 02:06 PM	#1
Justin Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 180	I wrap the tangs in some thin cloth,it will hold them securely and its easily removable,I vote for not glueing also.

12th October 2005, 07:41 PM	#2
Henk Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,209	NEVER EVER GLUE AN UKIRAN TO THE PEKSI !!!!!! Just use some cloth to wind around the peksi and put the ukiran on. Not too tight to prevent the ukiran from breaking or cracking. The ukiran should slide rather easily over the peksi just like turning a screw. Then the ukiran fits perfectly on your keris. Working so long on your keris and then destroying it by glueing the ukiran on it???

12th October 2005, 09:15 PM	#3
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Good grief! I have never seen so many capital letters, exclamation points and horror icons. You Kris people do get rather emotional, don't you? Smelling salts, anybody? And then, having recovered from vapors, please tell us how you really feel about Krazy Glue.

12th October 2005, 10:14 PM	#4
Henk Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,209	Ariel, Glueing a keris is simply not done. And why should you? All parts of a keris are replaceable and removeable. When a keris blade is cleaned and re-etched the blade goes into a bath. Having a beautiful ukiran glued on it, is not very smart. The only time you can use glue on a keris is to reglue the gandar to the wrangka. Don't we want our weapons to be original as they originally are? The Krazy glue might be good stuff to repair broken parts. And in that case you can use glue on a keris to repair broken parts.

12th October 2005, 10:27 PM	#5
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,280	If I gather all of your subtle hints together and read between the lines, one might possibly infer that perhaps using cloth/thread is slightly preferable over the use of glue. Thank you all for your help. I had read somewhere that one used glue, though most of the other references stated cloth or thread. The piece came to me glued in. It took me a little careful time to get the old glue out to do restoration. So.....cloth/thread it is. Any perference: cloth or thread or any other advise?

12th October 2005, 11:24 PM	#6
marto suwignyo Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 52	Mr. Battara In olden times the handles of keris were most often fixed to the pesi with damar. I have read that in pre war Malaya people used melted gramaphone records to fix keris handles in place. These days, we do sometimes use jabung, which a mixture of damar, wax and ground terracotta, to fix a handle with a short or thin pesi. This can be easily removed if it necessary by gentle application of heat to the sorsoran. Sometimes hair has been used. If your keris has a normally strong pesi, and if it Bali keris it probably will have, you should just use a pressure fit, as everybody else has already said.However, rather than use cloth I suggest that you use knitting wool. Cloth does not compress very well, and if the handle too tight it might split.

13th October 2005, 01:13 AM	#7
nechesh Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 940	Gee Ariel, why don't you tell us what you really think about us "Kris people". I trust this was not meant with any derogatory intention. No offense taken. Marto is, of course, right. Other more "fixed" methods of hilt attachment have been used. I had always heard of pitch being used. Is that the same stuff as the damar you mention Marto? Certainly it would make sense that any keris that might end up being used martially would need to have a well adhered handle to be at all useful. But as Marto points out, these other materials used are not nearly as permanent as epoxy of the dreaded Crazy Glue. Just heat and gentle manipulation will free the blade. The keris seems a fairly unique weapon (in many ways really) in that the removal and changability of many of it's parts (hilt, mendak, wrongko) are actually a part of the culture surrounding the blade, whether to signify some reward or added prominence in life or the changing of hands from one owner to the next. And as Henk points out, regular cleansing ceromonies require the blade be removed from the hilt. Wow, i actually got through this entire post without using a horror icon! ........damn!