Damascus Saber for appreciation / Sable de Damasco para apreciación

[Jim McDougall]

Fernando, thank you for the vote of confidence my friend!
Actually, I believe Spiral is correct and that there was a type of Damascus imitation going on by the latter 19th century. I think in Russia it was called 'bulat', but cant recall offhand (I think its discussed in Figiel, and some of the others). Solingen by the end of the 19th and well into the 20th was heavily supplying Mexico, Central and South America with edged weapons so this extremely handsome example is understandably well represented.
I prefer not to use the term 'fake' for this type of Damascus, as it is an example of European interpretation in thier efforts to produce this elusive and mysterious steel whose secrets were long hidden with the heritage of the Middle and Near East, Central Asia and India.

[Fernando K]

Hola, Jim

Solamente pregunto porque el damasco no se vé en el fondo del dibujo con volutas o "scroll"; tampoco en el "recazo"

Afectuosamente. Fernando K

Hello, Jim

Only ask because the damask not go in the bottom of the drawing with scrolls or "scroll", nor in the "recazo"

Affectionately. Fernando K

[spiral]

As far as I recall Jim Bulat is Russian made wootz? This steel appears laminated to me. Such things were not that unusul in Europe, although not always etched to bring out the pattern I believe.

Fernando K. the damascus pattern is only visible where acid has been used to show the layers in the steel, it would detract from the scrolling etc. if the was overshadowed by the steel pattern, so that was left polished.

Spiral

[Fernando K]

Hola, Spiral:

Si el dibujo del "scroll" es un grabado al ácido, el fondo debería mostrar el dibujo del damasco. Yo no creo que se haya pulido el fondo tan bien, que se haya eliminado el dibujo o patron.

Queda asimismo el asunto del "recazo". Creo que si la hoja era de damasco, se destacaría el dibujo en una pàrte importante.

Tengo el catálogo de un a firma similar - Eichorn - de sables para todas partes del mundo - incluído Estados Unidos y Europa, y no hay un solo ejemplar de damasco.

Afectuosamente. Fernando K

Hello, Spiral:

If the the "scroll" pattern is an etching, the bottom should show the damascus pattern. I do not think the bottom has been polished so much that it removed the effect or pattern.

However the issue of "recazo" remains. I think if the blade were Damascus, the pattern would stand out in an important part.

I have the catalog of a signature similar to - Eichhorn - sabers for all parts of the world - including the United States and Europe, and there is no single damascus example.

Affectionately. Fernando K

[broadaxe]

Nice presentation saber, the steel appears to be legit pattern welded in original (past) etched condition. I've several, mostly can be dated to 1860-1880 era.
Bulat is the russian word for wootz, derived from Farsi - fulad. In its turn probably derived from the Hebrew word for steel plada.

[spiral]

Originally Posted by Fernando K

If the the "scroll" pattern is an etching, the bottom should show the damascus pattern. I do not think the bottom has been polished so much that it removed the effect or pattern.

However the issue of "recazo" remains. I think if the blade were Damascus, the pattern would stand out in an important part.

I have the catalog of a signature similar to - Eichhorn - sabers for all parts of the world - including the United States and Europe, and there is no single damascus example.

Affectionately. Fernando K

Thanks Broadaxe for the confirmation re. Bulat etc.

Hello again Fernando,

Ido understand your thoughts, but it is a laminated blade, I can "see" it is, Ive etched many,many blades.

Decorative etches & stamped riccasos can be finnished off without showing the blade structure. This did used to be done in Germany.

But if you wish to belive own thoughts, then please do! our thoughts help govern our lives after all, so we are used to trusting them. { I must admit this forum has finaly after many years also taught me that its pointless {or timewaisting.} to argue facts against peoples beliefs....}

But either way enjoy it, Its an interesting sword!


Best regards,
Spiral

[Fernando K]

Hola a todos:

Humildemente, puedo tener mis propias creencias, pero demando que alguien me explique como la parte decorativa, "scroll", sometida a la accion del ácido, no muestra el patron o diseño del damascus.

Afectuosamente. Fernando K

Hi all:

Humbly, I can have my own beliefs, but request that someone explain to me how the decorative, "scroll", under the action of acid, does not show the damascus pattern or design.

Affectionately. Fernando K