An Unusual Haquebut (Ganzer Haken), ca. 1440-1500

[Matchlock]

Just because lack of money pressed me to sell it - I guess all avid collectors know what I mean: there are times when you feel that you just need to have a certain item, and you got to lay your money down immediately. So when you know someone special who has been offering you fair money for an item from your collection, you sell it. Today, I guess I would not deaccession it.

On the other hand, I guess I still own the finest collection of earliest handgonnes I can imagine . You are no doubt the only mate around to judge this because you were in my collection!

I do remember it was tiny, about 30 cm in all, the bore being about 12-14 mm.

Anyway, I know where it went and will try and get the data. Please allow some time.

Just one more thought: as the only handgonnes I have ever noticed to have pierced tangs/tillers intended for attaching grips doubtlessly dated from the early 16th c. there is a chance that the tang on the barrel in question was added later during its working life.

For a better understanding, I attach images of several early 16th century tiller haquebuts with long and flat tangs obviously intended to be originally mounted with grips - just like the Landsknecht messers of the same period. As is evident in one close-up, some of them even retained their original grip nails!
Author's photos, taken in the Bayerisches Armeemuseum Ingolstadt some 30 years ago.

Please note that the date of 'ca. 1480' for the Ingolstadt haquebut in the bottom image given by a friend of mine actually should read 'ca. 1515-20'.


Best,
Michael

[Matchlock]

Addendum to post #10:

The overall length of the handgonne is 28.6 cm, the bore 13 mm.

m

[Spiridonov]

Originally Posted by Matchlock

Addendum to post #10:

The overall length of the handgonne is 28.6 cm, the bore 13 mm.

m

Michael, thank You! As You know exactly measurements is very important for me It's very pleasure that You've got it for me and another members of forum.
By the way, the grips like the grips of Landsknecht messers appears earlier than in begin of 16 century

[Matchlock]

Do you have sources for this thesis?

I would be glad to see them.

m

[Spiridonov]

Originally Posted by Matchlock

Do you have sources for this thesis?

I would be glad to see them.

m

I have made this photo in Sforza Castle when I was in Milan. This wall-painting is about 1460. And this is not earlies example of this type of tiller

[Matchlock]

That's true for Early Renaissance Italian edged weapons, Alexender,

Thank you so much!

My experience of doing research in earliest firearms for some 30 years has proved though that guns generally used to fall behind other stylistic trends in arts and crafts by at least some decades. E.g., if you find a Late Gothic roped frieze (Schnürlband) on some everday use item of ca. 1450, let's say a beaker, you will not find the same decorative element on barrels before the end the 15th c.

This I feel should be kept in mind when it comes to dating earliest guns. In the samples I posted above, the shape and length of the muzzle section, as well as the pronounced Renaissance-style sectioning of the Ingolstadt barrel by friezes, both give a fixed date of post quem, which is 1500 to 1510.

Best,
Michael

[Matchlock]

Another haquebut with long and flat integral tiller retaining transerverse nails for the missing grips, ca. 1500-15, in the Historisches Museum Bern, Switzerland.

Overall length 151 cm
weight 14.5 kg
barrel length 92 cm
bore length 90.5 cm
bore diameter 2.1 cm
outer muzzle diameter 4.7 cm
outer rear end diameter 6.1 cm
hook 10 x 5.8 cm
tiller length 59 cm

m