MINIATURE KNIVES/TRAVELLERS SAMPLES FOR COMMENT

kahnjar1 · 27th November 2011, 12:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiral

Interesting, ive never seen ones like Genes shown you in what I guess is a world wide arms catalouge? {I wonder how many dealers on this forum have flogged..... woops I better not say that..... might upset far to many people.}

But I have seen dozens of larger versians of what look like identical pieces to your minatue examples. look at the rivets, the poor shape of blades, course camel or buffalo bone grips, crude semi Persian revival carving etc.

Belief is a powerfull thing, its probably been responsible for more problems & death in the world than even greed has.

But we all our own.....right or wrong. even me.....

I realy dont know with definity about these, but know how they look to me.But thats just my belief so it could be wrong.

Spiral

Yes WWA from a 2001 issue I believe. I personally don't have a clue on the ones I have , and I should add, on behalf of, so am really trying to get some "accurate" information for the owner.
Stu

Lew · 28th November 2011, 12:58 PM

Hi Stu

Honestly these mini knives are nice but they look too fresh to me to be older than the later half of the 20th century. I figure 1985-2000. There is no oxidation present on the blades the bone looks freshly cut. They are just a good quality modern set of mini knives to me.

kahnjar1 · 28th November 2011, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lew

Hi Stu

Honestly these mini knives are nice but they look too fresh to me to be older than the later half of the 20th century. I figure 1985-2000. There is no oxidation present on the blades the bone looks freshly cut. They are just a good quality modern set of mini knives to me.

Hi Lew,
The flash has made the bone look quite clean but in fact it is ingrained with dirt/colouration. The blades have been cleaned

as is often the case when non collectors own them, so any patina which should be there is gone. The family from which they came has (according to them) owned them since the 1950s and they say they were not new then. Can only go with the provenance given.
Stu

Jim McDougall · 28th November 2011, 11:06 PM

Hi Stu,
Facinating topic!!! I think the guy to find on this subject is Roger Evans ("The Plug Bayonet", R.D.C.Evans).
Years ago he was THE authority on bayonets and wrote the column "Cold Steel" in several magazines on arms I believe. I recall he sold off all his bayonets and went into the study of miniature weapons, and I recall thinking how wonderfully bizarre and esoteric!!!!
He must have written something on them by now.

All the best,
Jim

kahnjar1 · 29th November 2011, 01:04 AM

Thanks Jim. It's amazing what turns up in NZ as we are so far away from everything here. These, though not "my thing", are rather interesting, and I had hoped that the story given to me was, at least in part, correct. Don't quite know what this style of Travellers samples (if that is what they are) would be doing in this part of the world, as I can not see anyone ordering from them here. Sufficient to say that they would make an interesting addition to the collection of someone who is interested in Islamic knives.
Regards Stu

Jim McDougall · 29th November 2011, 08:58 PM

Hi Stu,
It really is amazing what turns up down there!!!
I have always thought miniatures in general were fascinating, seeing such craftsmanship in such small scale. Actually it seems like living in a space smaller than most rooms in houses in this RV, it would be ideal to collect these since I have no place to put the full size ones

It seems like over the years a lot of times those Indonesian and Southeast Asian panoplies are found mounted on plaques. I have a book someplace on miniature arms from years ago, as I say pretty esoteric, and amazing.

I do know that creating these arms in lilliputian size was serious business and created as novelties often for royals and dignitaries usually as displays of craftsmanship by artisans. I think that was the primary purpose rather than as sales samples, and they were intended to impress and delight.

I was hoping for some other entries from readers world out there, but aint holdin my breath !!

All the best,
Jim

thinreadline · 29th November 2011, 09:19 PM

Hi
These are certainly World Wide Arms products. I have an identical set which I bought for my son over 15 years ago. They looked old and were reasonable quality , but copuld well have been made in India in recent times. However just because they were sold by WWA it does not mean they are fake.. WWA have turned some pretty fantastic pieces of Indo Persian gear over the last 40 years ... in the early days Les Rawlinson was always over in India buying up armouries .
On another point , I am a friend of Roger Evans .. the only miniatures he is interested in are miniaure bayonets , so I dont think he will be much help here .

28th November 2011, 12:58 PM	#2
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	Hi Stu Honestly these mini knives are nice but they look too fresh to me to be older than the later half of the 20th century. I figure 1985-2000. There is no oxidation present on the blades the bone looks freshly cut. They are just a good quality modern set of mini knives to me.

28th November 2011, 11:06 PM	#4
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,467	Hi Stu, Facinating topic!!! I think the guy to find on this subject is Roger Evans ("The Plug Bayonet", R.D.C.Evans). Years ago he was THE authority on bayonets and wrote the column "Cold Steel" in several magazines on arms I believe. I recall he sold off all his bayonets and went into the study of miniature weapons, and I recall thinking how wonderfully bizarre and esoteric!!!! He must have written something on them by now. All the best, Jim

29th November 2011, 01:04 AM	#5
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,801	Thanks Jim. It's amazing what turns up in NZ as we are so far away from everything here. These, though not "my thing", are rather interesting, and I had hoped that the story given to me was, at least in part, correct. Don't quite know what this style of Travellers samples (if that is what they are) would be doing in this part of the world, as I can not see anyone ordering from them here. Sufficient to say that they would make an interesting addition to the collection of someone who is interested in Islamic knives. Regards Stu

29th November 2011, 08:58 PM	#6
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,467	Hi Stu, It really is amazing what turns up down there!!! I have always thought miniatures in general were fascinating, seeing such craftsmanship in such small scale. Actually it seems like living in a space smaller than most rooms in houses in this RV, it would be ideal to collect these since I have no place to put the full size ones It seems like over the years a lot of times those Indonesian and Southeast Asian panoplies are found mounted on plaques. I have a book someplace on miniature arms from years ago, as I say pretty esoteric, and amazing. I do know that creating these arms in lilliputian size was serious business and created as novelties often for royals and dignitaries usually as displays of craftsmanship by artisans. I think that was the primary purpose rather than as sales samples, and they were intended to impress and delight. I was hoping for some other entries from readers world out there, but aint holdin my breath !! All the best, Jim

29th November 2011, 09:19 PM	#7
thinreadline Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Wirral Posts: 1,204	Hi These are certainly World Wide Arms products. I have an identical set which I bought for my son over 15 years ago. They looked old and were reasonable quality , but copuld well have been made in India in recent times. However just because they were sold by WWA it does not mean they are fake.. WWA have turned some pretty fantastic pieces of Indo Persian gear over the last 40 years ... in the early days Les Rawlinson was always over in India buying up armouries . On another point , I am a friend of Roger Evans .. the only miniatures he is interested in are miniaure bayonets , so I dont think he will be much help here .