Another Unique Malay Sundang

[Gustav]

Jose, I don't have the smallest part of your knowledge about okir ornamentics, yet if it more likely is a Peninsular work, I doubt we can call it okir.

The flowers on it, - this is the point of question - they look close to way peonies are depicted (comparing to other examples of design with this flower from Peninsula and Sumatra in silverwork and woodcarving), and peonies are not traditional Malay or Sumtran in design. As I understand, they are mark of strong chinese influence.

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by Gustav

Jose, I don't have the smallest part of your knowledge about okir ornamentics, yet if it more likely is a Peninsular work, I doubt we can call it okir.

The flowers on it, - this is the point of question - they look close to way peonies are depicted (comparing to other examples of design with this flower from Peninsula and Sumatra in silverwork and woodcarving), and peonies are not traditional Malay or Sumtran in design. As I understand, they are mark of strong chinese influence.

Hello Gustav,

this is what I have read and learned as well, the peonie flower is a chinese motif so far I know.
Look for example this thread: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=13374

Regards,

Detlef

[Battara]

So what you both are saying is that anytime we see this particular flower motif it is of Chinese origin................interesting................

[Gustav]

As I said, it is the question if peonie is peonie is peonie, yet otherwise when we see it on Peninsula or Sumatra, this surely is chinese influenced and most probably chinese work.

[Sajen]

Hi Jose,

yes, agree with Gustav.

Regards,

Detlef

[DAHenkel]

While this is clearly Malay I have a feeling it is not Peninsular but could be Riau or Bornean Malay. I have some pictures floating around somewhere but I can't find any of them at the moment. Will dig a bit deeper when I have time...

[CharlesS]

Would love to see some pics of them as worn...Thanks DAHenkel

[kai]

Hello Dave,

While this is clearly Malay I have a feeling it is not Peninsular but could be Riau or Bornean Malay. I have some pictures floating around somewhere but I can't find any of them at the moment. Will dig a bit deeper when I have time...

Yes, Riau sounds good to me, too - I'd consider the whole straits area (western/southern peninsula, northeastern coastal Sumatra, and the whole Riau archipelago) as predominantly of Malay culture.

The few antique keris sundang from Brunei I've seen had blades that looked like typical Sulu blades (considering the historical ties between the 2 sultanates, this is not really surprising). Have you pics of any examples from other Malay settlements on Borneo?

Regards,
Kai