Pre-contact Maori whalebone club

fearn · 14th September 2010, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kronckew

did not the indians of the pacific northwest have hardened copper tools?

Hardened copper isn't in the same league as steel. It will cut, but there's a reason why the European copper age was called the "chalcolithic" (=copper stone). As far as I remember, the PNW people used stone and antler tools for woodworking. I have no idea what they would use for whalebone, but if it's as soft as Ron reports, I'd guess the same.

F

Atlantia · 14th September 2010, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fearn

Hardened copper isn't in the same league as steel. It will cut, but there's a reason why the European copper age was called the "chalcolithic" (=copper stone). As far as I remember, the PNW people used stone and antler tools for woodworking. I have no idea what they would use for whalebone, but if it's as soft as Ron reports, I'd guess the same.

F

You can knap flint with antler, and flint tools would carve bone or even marine ivory fairly easily.....
Don't know if thats relevant here

Ron Anderson · 15th September 2010, 01:36 AM

Hi

I haven't encountered that much whale bone but my experience is that it's relatively light compared to other forms of bone. I have encountered very light whalebone from Alaska before.

I would think its easier to carve too.

This whalebone is very porous, as you can see from photos posted here.

The club has a fair bit of weight, because it's pretty substantial. But it's not heavy for its size. It's light actually.

An interesting choice of material for a club, when you think about it. I think it's strong enough to pack a punch but light enough to ensure a good velocity in the swing.

It may be age, but it may also be plain evolutionary factors, that makes this bone lighter. It may have as much to do with the fact that whales require a lighter mass bone to compensate for their huge size. Or perhaps spending so much time in water also affects this.

Rick · 15th September 2010, 02:49 AM

Whalebone is indeed very porous stuff; quite oily and smelly .

Not that hard a material; but we're not talking about hitting rocks with these things .

We find the bones around here quite often .

Ron Anderson · 15th September 2010, 03:13 AM

It is an interesting point.

Whale bone is of course a popular material for old New Zealand clubs too. And it has some symbolic significance there I think, though I'm sure they were more than symbolic - I believe they were actually used as clubs. But stone clubs, greenstone clubs certainly, are harder and more damaging, without question. Nonetheless, there is a high value placed on whalebone clubs.

Mostly, it's only the old clubs that are made of whale bone. For obvious reasons. Unless you find a dead whale on the beach these days, you ain't going to find whale bone. Whales are no longer hunted in most parts of the world.

fearn · 15th September 2010, 04:25 AM

I have been wondering about the efficacy of whalebone in a club. It appears that someone with a whalebone club would use a different set of targets than, say, someone using a jade mere. Meres got used on really hard targets, like the skull and hinge of the jaw.

I guess the advantage is that it's easier to make them, and if you get a whale, you get a lot of material in one spot.

Best,

F

Ron Anderson · 15th September 2010, 08:56 AM

Hi Fearn

2 things spring to mind: Yes, these are so much easier to make then greenstone. I've heard reports of maori taking years to carve a patu from greenstone.

Bearing this in mind, the alternative is wood. And whalebone probably compares quite well to most woods in terms of strength.

Also, I wonder if being so porous ensures the bone is less likely to break. I wonder if it provides a certain springiness or flexibility, and hence a certain structural strength. I suspect it might.

15th September 2010, 01:36 AM	#3
Ron Anderson Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 228	Hi I haven't encountered that much whale bone but my experience is that it's relatively light compared to other forms of bone. I have encountered very light whalebone from Alaska before. I would think its easier to carve too. This whalebone is very porous, as you can see from photos posted here. The club has a fair bit of weight, because it's pretty substantial. But it's not heavy for its size. It's light actually. An interesting choice of material for a club, when you think about it. I think it's strong enough to pack a punch but light enough to ensure a good velocity in the swing. It may be age, but it may also be plain evolutionary factors, that makes this bone lighter. It may have as much to do with the fact that whales require a lighter mass bone to compensate for their huge size. Or perhaps spending so much time in water also affects this.

15th September 2010, 02:49 AM	#4
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,347	Whalebone is indeed very porous stuff; quite oily and smelly . Not that hard a material; but we're not talking about hitting rocks with these things . We find the bones around here quite often .

15th September 2010, 03:13 AM	#5
Ron Anderson Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 228	It is an interesting point. Whale bone is of course a popular material for old New Zealand clubs too. And it has some symbolic significance there I think, though I'm sure they were more than symbolic - I believe they were actually used as clubs. But stone clubs, greenstone clubs certainly, are harder and more damaging, without question. Nonetheless, there is a high value placed on whalebone clubs. Mostly, it's only the old clubs that are made of whale bone. For obvious reasons. Unless you find a dead whale on the beach these days, you ain't going to find whale bone. Whales are no longer hunted in most parts of the world.

15th September 2010, 04:25 AM	#6
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	I have been wondering about the efficacy of whalebone in a club. It appears that someone with a whalebone club would use a different set of targets than, say, someone using a jade mere. Meres got used on really hard targets, like the skull and hinge of the jaw. I guess the advantage is that it's easier to make them, and if you get a whale, you get a lot of material in one spot. Best, F

15th September 2010, 08:56 AM	#7
Ron Anderson Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 228	Hi Fearn 2 things spring to mind: Yes, these are so much easier to make then greenstone. I've heard reports of maori taking years to carve a patu from greenstone. Bearing this in mind, the alternative is wood. And whalebone probably compares quite well to most woods in terms of strength. Also, I wonder if being so porous ensures the bone is less likely to break. I wonder if it provides a certain springiness or flexibility, and hence a certain structural strength. I suspect it might.