Sword for ID on SFI

Tim Simmons · 7th June 2005, 05:49 PM

The grip does look N African but I am going to say, the knuckle bow looks a bit Indo/Persian like on a tuwar or somethig like that.The construction is also like Indo/Persian knives and Afghan in particular.What does it most for me is the Peacock ingraving ,an asian bird I believe.I will hazard a guess that it is Afghan or something from the old NW Frontier.Tim

ariel · 7th June 2005, 06:46 PM

Is it just my impression, or is the blade slightly down-curved, yataghan-like?
Sossun pattah blade?

fearn · 7th June 2005, 08:01 PM

Could this be some sort of interpretation of a khyber knife? I realize that it's not the "right" shape, but it is in the right size range.

Fearn

Rick · 7th June 2005, 08:15 PM

I don't think the decoration is N.African in style .
That leaves Indo Persia and the NW frontier as Tim has said .
Those look like architectural details behind the Peacock , those elements remind me of some N. persian rugs I have seen .
Not to mention the Peacock Throne of Persia .
I can see the Indian influence in the knuckle guard but the hilt is real oddball .

Whatever it is I like it !!

RSWORD · 7th June 2005, 10:28 PM

When I first saw thing thing it sort of reminded me of some Naga swords from the Assam region. They have a sword with cast bronze or brass hilt with knucklebow and large chopper like blade. Although this example is different than the "typical" Naga sword that I am speaking, it isn't too far a stretch to be an unusual variant. I would love to see the blade up close on this example to see if it might be an Indian import and watered or if it had some of the more Tibetan-like watering you more often see on blades from this region.

Conogre · 8th June 2005, 04:35 AM

While the nimchas are N, African, they are common as far as Iraq.....the "arch" at the Bagdad airport are two huge crossed nimchas, I believe (I would have expected Saifs ), which may account for the styling partially.
As to the peacock, that style is unusual for Indian art, and almost looks reminiscent of a Guinea Fowl.
Since it's a chopper, on a scale of 1-10, I'd have to give it a 15 **grin**
That is definitely unique, and appears undoubtedly to be user oriented.
Sweet, any way you look at it.
Justin commented that the little "hook" in the inner hilt reminds him of many Turkish pieces, just to add to the confusion.
Mike

Aqtai · 8th June 2005, 11:03 AM

Going back to the pictures I posted above, Morrocan nimchas also have knuckleguards. Isn't it possible that this is a nimcha who decoration has been influenced by imported Iranian weapons?

I have seen at least one book that called the Iranians "the armourers of the Islamic World", or words to that effect. There is little doubt that from the 17th century onwards, the Ottomans frequently used imported Iranian arms and armour, so why not not North Africans? After all Morroco's neighbors Algeria and Tunisia were both part of the Ottoman Empire.

7th June 2005, 05:49 PM	#1
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,875	The grip does look N African but I am going to say, the knuckle bow looks a bit Indo/Persian like on a tuwar or somethig like that.The construction is also like Indo/Persian knives and Afghan in particular.What does it most for me is the Peacock ingraving ,an asian bird I believe.I will hazard a guess that it is Afghan or something from the old NW Frontier.Tim

7th June 2005, 06:46 PM	#2
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Is it just my impression, or is the blade slightly down-curved, yataghan-like? Sossun pattah blade?

7th June 2005, 08:01 PM	#3
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Could this be some sort of interpretation of a khyber knife? I realize that it's not the "right" shape, but it is in the right size range. Fearn

7th June 2005, 08:15 PM	#4
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,347	I don't think the decoration is N.African in style . That leaves Indo Persia and the NW frontier as Tim has said . Those look like architectural details behind the Peacock , those elements remind me of some N. persian rugs I have seen . Not to mention the Peacock Throne of Persia . I can see the Indian influence in the knuckle guard but the hilt is real oddball . Whatever it is I like it !!

7th June 2005, 10:28 PM	#5
RSWORD Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greensboro, NC Posts: 1,087	When I first saw thing thing it sort of reminded me of some Naga swords from the Assam region. They have a sword with cast bronze or brass hilt with knucklebow and large chopper like blade. Although this example is different than the "typical" Naga sword that I am speaking, it isn't too far a stretch to be an unusual variant. I would love to see the blade up close on this example to see if it might be an Indian import and watered or if it had some of the more Tibetan-like watering you more often see on blades from this region.

8th June 2005, 04:35 AM	#6
Conogre Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 371	While the nimchas are N, African, they are common as far as Iraq.....the "arch" at the Bagdad airport are two huge crossed nimchas, I believe (I would have expected Saifs ), which may account for the styling partially. As to the peacock, that style is unusual for Indian art, and almost looks reminiscent of a Guinea Fowl. Since it's a chopper, on a scale of 1-10, I'd have to give it a 15 grin That is definitely unique, and appears undoubtedly to be user oriented. Sweet, any way you look at it. Justin commented that the little "hook" in the inner hilt reminds him of many Turkish pieces, just to add to the confusion. Mike

8th June 2005, 11:03 AM	#7
Aqtai Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Merseyside, UK Posts: 222	Going back to the pictures I posted above, Morrocan nimchas also have knuckleguards. Isn't it possible that this is a nimcha who decoration has been influenced by imported Iranian weapons? I have seen at least one book that called the Iranians "the armourers of the Islamic World", or words to that effect. There is little doubt that from the 17th century onwards, the Ottomans frequently used imported Iranian arms and armour, so why not not North Africans? After all Morroco's neighbors Algeria and Tunisia were both part of the Ottoman Empire.