Interesting keris making video

Pusaka · 31st July 2014, 01:31 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D3jZm1sPMDc

Above is the most interesting keris making video I have watched for a number of reasons.

Firstly it shows you some of the ceremony involved, offerings, full moon etc

Secondly most keris making vids I have seen show folding steel/nickel from factory whilst this vid shows them making the keris from raw materials taken from the ground.

Thirdly a technique is shown that I had never seen before in which the palmor material is put into a steel tube and both ends hammered down.

Fourthly and most interesting to me was the metals put into those tubes to make the pamor, meteorite and what looks like a gold chain are two things I picked out.

Using a tube solves many problems with using a material that does not readily forge easily in my mind.

A. G. Maisey · 31st July 2014, 04:50 AM

Good!!

The commentary is in Krama Inggil (high level Javanese) and I only half understand all that is being said, however, the work that is being done looks like it was filmed in Bali.

Whatever. Its really good stuff.

The use of the tube for consolidating small pieces of material is actually a very old technique, but in the old days they didn't use a tube, they made a packet and folded the small pieces into it. The tube is the same idea but it makes it easier.

Pusaka · 31st July 2014, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Good!!

The commentary is in Krama Inggil (high level Javanese) and I only half understand all that is being said, however, the work that is being done looks like it was filmed in Bali.

Whatever. Its really good stuff.

The use of the tube for consolidating small pieces of material is actually a very old technique, but in the old days they didn't use a tube, they made a packet and folded the small pieces into it. The tube is the same idea but it makes it easier.

What do you think about using gold in the palmor, is it something you had heard of before?

A. G. Maisey · 31st July 2014, 11:17 AM

Yes, I've heard of it, but frankly, I'm rather dubious about the way it would react in a weld. The melt point of both iron and gold is fairly close,I think from memory, gold about 1100C , iron about 1100C to 1500C, so it might possibly happen that they could form a weld, but it may not bond well. I don't know, but my guess would be that even if it did form a weld it would not be a strong joint.

In Javanese and Balinese belief there is a lot of very improbable stuff. Additionally, in the keris belief system, amongst people who are not directly involved in the making of keris, there is a lot of misinformation and erroneous belief. Very often "information" is presented in a way that reinforces that belief. For instance, the way in which this video has been made is in fact misinformation in that it shows the way lay people want to believe keris are made, rather than the way they are made. Still, I found it very interesting because it shows a small scale smelt process that probably did exist at some time in the past, and the actual hands-on forge process is a good, solid representation. The window dressing is BS.

The video was made by a bloke who lives not far from my Javanese address, and it has been made to entertain, but stripped of the window dressing it is good, solid stuff. My guess is that it was probably made in Madura or Bali, but much of the background is in a Balinese context, so it might have been made there.

I find the commentary in Krama Inggil very peculiar, as not a lot of people in this day and age are conversant with this speech level. Moreover it is Surakarta Krama Inggil, which limits 100% understanding even more. It would reach more people if it had been done in Indonesian. But this was the whole objective of the video:- to impress, and it surely does do that.

Good video. Technically correct process. Very informative. But a bit more elaborate than it needs to be.

Sajen · 31st July 2014, 01:04 PM

Very good video, thank you for sharing!

Alan, why is the commentary vocalize in second part of the video?

Regards,
Detlef

A. G. Maisey · 31st July 2014, 01:22 PM

You mean "sung" Detlef?

Artistic effect. As I said, the video is for entertainment.

31st July 2014, 01:31 AM	#1
Pusaka Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 341	Interesting keris making video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D3jZm1sPMDc Above is the most interesting keris making video I have watched for a number of reasons. Firstly it shows you some of the ceremony involved, offerings, full moon etc Secondly most keris making vids I have seen show folding steel/nickel from factory whilst this vid shows them making the keris from raw materials taken from the ground. Thirdly a technique is shown that I had never seen before in which the palmor material is put into a steel tube and both ends hammered down. Fourthly and most interesting to me was the metals put into those tubes to make the pamor, meteorite and what looks like a gold chain are two things I picked out. Using a tube solves many problems with using a material that does not readily forge easily in my mind.

31st July 2014, 04:50 AM	#2
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	Good!! The commentary is in Krama Inggil (high level Javanese) and I only half understand all that is being said, however, the work that is being done looks like it was filmed in Bali. Whatever. Its really good stuff. The use of the tube for consolidating small pieces of material is actually a very old technique, but in the old days they didn't use a tube, they made a packet and folded the small pieces into it. The tube is the same idea but it makes it easier.

31st July 2014, 11:17 AM	#4
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	Yes, I've heard of it, but frankly, I'm rather dubious about the way it would react in a weld. The melt point of both iron and gold is fairly close,I think from memory, gold about 1100C , iron about 1100C to 1500C, so it might possibly happen that they could form a weld, but it may not bond well. I don't know, but my guess would be that even if it did form a weld it would not be a strong joint. In Javanese and Balinese belief there is a lot of very improbable stuff. Additionally, in the keris belief system, amongst people who are not directly involved in the making of keris, there is a lot of misinformation and erroneous belief. Very often "information" is presented in a way that reinforces that belief. For instance, the way in which this video has been made is in fact misinformation in that it shows the way lay people want to believe keris are made, rather than the way they are made. Still, I found it very interesting because it shows a small scale smelt process that probably did exist at some time in the past, and the actual hands-on forge process is a good, solid representation. The window dressing is BS. The video was made by a bloke who lives not far from my Javanese address, and it has been made to entertain, but stripped of the window dressing it is good, solid stuff. My guess is that it was probably made in Madura or Bali, but much of the background is in a Balinese context, so it might have been made there. I find the commentary in Krama Inggil very peculiar, as not a lot of people in this day and age are conversant with this speech level. Moreover it is Surakarta Krama Inggil, which limits 100% understanding even more. It would reach more people if it had been done in Indonesian. But this was the whole objective of the video:- to impress, and it surely does do that. Good video. Technically correct process. Very informative. But a bit more elaborate than it needs to be.

31st July 2014, 01:04 PM	#5
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,485	Very good video, thank you for sharing! Alan, why is the commentary vocalize in second part of the video? Regards, Detlef

31st July 2014, 01:22 PM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	You mean "sung" Detlef? Artistic effect. As I said, the video is for entertainment.