Arab (Yemeni) sword from Djibouti

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 1st March 2020, 05:06 PM

Reference.
A. http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...light=karabela
B. THE AMAZING PICTURE AT #1 OF A KARABELA AT http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...5&page=1&pp=30

We normally view this form as Karabela.. These are quite common appearing from Yemen centres like Sanaa with blades probably from Solingen. I wonder what you mean by straight...? These blades are slightly curved usually and this one appears to be such. Flexible to what degree...? I would think it bends to a few degrees but is quite rigid with a thick back blade. They are often found around Yemen; in neighboring countries and often in Oman and The Zanj...as well as into The Gulf. Often hilts were stripped off weapons and the expensive items re cycled onto Jambia etc... and less expensive hilts matched onto these blades and pushed across the middle Easts souks especially since about 1970 where they were often seen in souks like Muttrah and Salalah..who purchased them from Sanaa....and on and on... where you will still find loads of these still... and in souks up the Gulf like Sharjah et etc...

kahnjar1 · 1st March 2020, 08:46 PM

Hi Martin,
Here is another which I have. Very similar but this has original scabbard.
I just noticed that this was the subject of Ibrahiim's "A" link above. It has obviously traveled a bit since the original post by wodimi.
Stu

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 1st March 2020, 10:58 PM

I have only one or two questions about Karabella and that is;

1. Are they related in any way to Othmanli other weapons such as Kilij or Yatagans?

2. What is the origin of the term Karabella please...?

kahnjar1 · 2nd March 2020, 03:19 AM

Hi Ibrahiim,
I have always understood that the word relates to the actual SHAPE of the hilt. Here is the definition of KARABELA from Wikipedia which suggests that this is correct. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karabela
So connection to different blade styles such as Kilij would (I think) depend on the shape of the hilt attached.
Stu

Martin Lubojacky · 2nd March 2020, 06:50 AM

Thank you all for comments. Ibrahiim, I ment the blade was not bent to the sides (and maybe except of the first 25 cms it is also springy ...).

I remember a relatively long discussion on the origin of karabela name here in this forum (a few years back ...)

Stu, your saber is nearly identical, maybe the same workshop ! But in much better condition.

Kubur · 2nd March 2020, 04:36 PM

Habibi Ibrahiim
Please look at our web pages, you will find a long discussion about the origin of the karabela.
In short, some think that it originates from the town of Kerbala in Iran and others think (like me) that it originates from Ottoman Turkey. It's the reason why you have these hilts from Poland to Yemen...

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 2nd March 2020, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kubur

Habibi Ibrahiim
Please look at our web pages, you will find a long discussion about the origin of the karabela.
In short, some think that it originates from the town of Kerbala in Iran and others think (like me) that it originates from Ottoman Turkey. It's the reason why you have these hilts from Poland to Yemen...

Part of the reason for my questions is the detail contained in those references and I believe the theory pointed to quite different origins... I see similar hilts in the Kilij and hawk heads across many regions and wondered if they were of the same essential breed... Likenesses appear on many variants including Yatagans and Russian Cossack and Caucasian forms...

ariel · 2nd March 2020, 05:43 PM

Khorasani claimed that this hilt was invented by Shah Abbas I on the basis of the configuration of windows in a Karbala Mosque. This is patently wrong.
Such handles were present well before Abbas was born (1571), and not in Persia.

See Pietro Befulco " Madonna with baby and the saints", painted in 1495

Also, karabela handles were widespread in all countries that contacted with Ottoman Empire, but were exceedingly rare in Persia proper.

1st March 2020, 08:46 PM	#2
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,730	Hi Martin, Here is another which I have. Very similar but this has original scabbard. I just noticed that this was the subject of Ibrahiim's "A" link above. It has obviously traveled a bit since the original post by wodimi. Stu Attached Images

2nd March 2020, 05:43 PM	#8
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Khorasani claimed that this hilt was invented by Shah Abbas I on the basis of the configuration of windows in a Karbala Mosque. This is patently wrong. Such handles were present well before Abbas was born (1571), and not in Persia. See Pietro Befulco " Madonna with baby and the saints", painted in 1495 Also, karabela handles were widespread in all countries that contacted with Ottoman Empire, but were exceedingly rare in Persia proper. Attached Images

1st March 2020, 05:06 PM	#1
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	Reference. A. http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...light=karabela B. THE AMAZING PICTURE AT #1 OF A KARABELA AT http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...5&page=1&pp=30 We normally view this form as Karabela.. These are quite common appearing from Yemen centres like Sanaa with blades probably from Solingen. I wonder what you mean by straight...? These blades are slightly curved usually and this one appears to be such. Flexible to what degree...? I would think it bends to a few degrees but is quite rigid with a thick back blade. They are often found around Yemen; in neighboring countries and often in Oman and The Zanj...as well as into The Gulf. Often hilts were stripped off weapons and the expensive items re cycled onto Jambia etc... and less expensive hilts matched onto these blades and pushed across the middle Easts souks especially since about 1970 where they were often seen in souks like Muttrah and Salalah..who purchased them from Sanaa....and on and on... where you will still find loads of these still... and in souks up the Gulf like Sharjah et etc... Attached Images Last edited by Ibrahiim al Balooshi; 1st March 2020 at 06:07 PM.

1st March 2020, 10:58 PM	#3
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	I have only one or two questions about Karabella and that is; 1. Are they related in any way to Othmanli other weapons such as Kilij or Yatagans? 2. What is the origin of the term Karabella please...?

2nd March 2020, 03:19 AM	#4
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,730	Hi Ibrahiim, I have always understood that the word relates to the actual SHAPE of the hilt. Here is the definition of KARABELA from Wikipedia which suggests that this is correct. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karabela So connection to different blade styles such as Kilij would (I think) depend on the shape of the hilt attached. Stu

2nd March 2020, 06:50 AM	#5
Martin Lubojacky Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 836	Thank you all for comments. Ibrahiim, I ment the blade was not bent to the sides (and maybe except of the first 25 cms it is also springy ...). I remember a relatively long discussion on the origin of karabela name here in this forum (a few years back ...) Stu, your saber is nearly identical, maybe the same workshop ! But in much better condition.

2nd March 2020, 04:36 PM	#6
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	Habibi Ibrahiim Please look at our web pages, you will find a long discussion about the origin of the karabela. In short, some think that it originates from the town of Kerbala in Iran and others think (like me) that it originates from Ottoman Turkey. It's the reason why you have these hilts from Poland to Yemen...