my last keris

[Marcokeris]

Originally Posted by Sajen

Agree with David, sorry Marco.

there is only one small detail: the scabbard in the photo does not have a pendok and has the same painting on both sides. so by turning the scabbard 180 degrees when I extract the kris I have the handle in the right position to be held correctly in the hand. With a pendok scabbard this rotation to properly extract the kris would be an eyesore.

[David]

Originally Posted by Marcokeris

there is only one small detail: the scabbard in the photo does not have a pendok and has the same painting on both sides. so by turning the scabbard 180 degrees when I extract the kris I have the handle in the right position to be held correctly in the hand. With a pendok scabbard this rotation to properly extract the kris would be an eyesore.

I'm not sure what you are trying to say here. The hilt on the keris in the photo simply needs to be rotated 180 degrees. Problem solved.

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by Marcokeris

there is only one small detail: the scabbard in the photo does not have a pendok and has the same painting on both sides. so by turning the scabbard 180 degrees when I extract the kris I have the handle in the right position to be held correctly in the hand. With a pendok scabbard this rotation to properly extract the kris would be an eyesore.

Dear Marco,
You can turn the keris with the painted scabbard completely when inside the scabbard or just the handle as you like and as many times as you like, it doesn't change the fact that the front of the blade points to the front of the scabbard. In the shown picture the handle simple shows to the wrong side.

Regards,
Detlef

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by Marcokeris

With a pendok scabbard this rotation to properly extract the kris would be an eyesore.

Disagree, the shown keris with the handle showing in the wrong direction is an eyesore!

Isn't it??

[Marcokeris]

Originally Posted by Sajen

Disagree, the shown keris with the handle showing in the wrong direction is an eyesore!

Isn't it??

Isn't it??

[David]

Gentlemen. I'm really not sure where this thread is going. None of the examples you have shown,Marco, present sheaths that have the keris in reverse position like your example is. That seems to be the really unusual aspect of your keris that we were all commenting on.
We have all seen Javanese hilts presented with the hilts reversed. Yes, even in published books. That does not necessarily mean that is the generally accepted position for such hilts. But yes, surely it happens.
So i am not sure what all these recent posts are trying to establish.
I respectfully suggest we move on to more fruitful topics.

[Marcokeris]

Originally Posted by David

Gentlemen. I'm really not sure where this thread is going. None of the examples you have shown,Marco, present sheaths that have the keris in reverse position like your example is. That seems to be the really unusual aspect of your keris that we were all commenting on.
We have all seen Javanese hilts presented with the hilts reversed. Yes, even in published books. That does not necessarily mean that is the generally accepted position for such hilts. But yes, surely it happens.
So i am not sure what all these recent posts are trying to establish.
I respectfully suggest we move on to more fruitful topics.

I apologize to you David but I find it correct to post this ... and then I shut up
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...eris+Cengkrong

[milandro]

there is no doubt that that thread shows a similarly oriented kris as Marco's.

And Ganjawulung is in Jakarta so not an European intetpretation

We could postulate that this is " wrong" but if several people thought this was right then maybe is right.

I have looked it up and SOME Banyumas cengkrong keris, seem to conform to this " tradition", others don't. One thing is for sure, Marco is not alone in this.

[Sajen]

Marcos blade isn't a cengkrong blade!

[David]

Originally Posted by milandro

there is no doubt that that thread shows a similarly oriented kris as Marco's.

And Ganjawulung is in Jakarta so not an European intetpretation

We could postulate that this is " wrong" but if several people thought this was right then maybe is right.

I have looked it up and SOME Banyumas cengkrong keris, seem to conform to this " tradition", others don't. One thing is for sure, Marco is not alone in this.

Well, "no doubt"? I couldn't say. Because those photos do not show us what it looks like from the top of the wrongko. Usually these hilts are not fixed in place so the hilt could have quite easily been turned around for the photo of when the blade is in the sheath. Not saying this is what was done. Only that there is certainly a possibility for doubt until a revealing photograph can be shown.
Now if indeed this is another example of a blade that actually is mounted in reverse position in the sheath then that make TWO. Two examples like this in all my years of looking at keris and all of Alan's years of looking at keris and all of Detlef's years, etc. etc. So if indeed you did find one other example (and i still have not seen the photograph that will prove that), then we still have an anomaly working here. Something far outside the norm. If the intention is to show that this reversal of position in the sheath is the accepted norm for keris of this type i believe we are a long way from that being shown.
So my only question here is why? Not why was it done, by why is it so important to establish this as being within the norms of Javanese keris culture. For myself, i have always appreciated the occasional oddity. And i am afraid that for the time being this remains an oddity. If it was mine i would simply enjoy it.