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22nd November 2019, 03:22 PM | #1 |
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In Hindu Arms and Ritual Robert Elgood seem to think that a sword of this kind, with an Afghan hilt is a marriage.
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22nd November 2019, 03:43 PM | #2 |
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Jens,
That would suggest that Rajput " kings" who moved to Himachal Pradesh just made their swords look more local and the term " Indo-Afghani swords" might be a misnomer. This is supported ( albeit weakly) by the variety of handles used. Sword handles in India were replaced like worn shoes. The possibility #2 mentioned earlier seems quite likely. |
22nd November 2019, 04:33 PM | #3 |
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Ariel,
What shall I say? The best answer is, I dont know. I have seen these swords in pictures, and the one on exhibition in Copenhagen, at The David Collection in 1982, but I have never researched these swords, as I have never owned one. Quote. That would suggest that Rajput " kings" who moved to Himachal Pradesh just made their swords look more local and the term " Indo-Afghani swords" might be a misnomer. Unquote. Which time era do you refer to? |
22nd November 2019, 05:34 PM | #4 |
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Very interesting topic!
What strikes me at these swords is the unmistakenly Indian construction of the blade (with chiseled central ridge and reinforced edges). |
22nd November 2019, 08:56 PM | #5 |
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Marius,
You are absolutely correct: the blades are unmistakeably S. Indian. This strengthens the argument that the handles were a later modification. So, should we stop calling them Indo-Afghani? Probably not: the modifications on many of them were of Afghani styles. By the same logic, Persian and purely Indian blades are in fact “( Something)- Afghani”, we just need to look separately on different components of a given sword. I may show some swords that, in my estimation are purely Afghani based on both handle and blade. Handles are simple: pulwar-like are unmistakeable. Can we start describing features of a genuinely Afghani blade? Let’s open the floodgates! Go on! |
22nd November 2019, 10:12 PM | #6 |
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Jens,
Rajputs started emigrating to the peri - Himalayan hills around 12 century. This process became more and more active by the 16-17 century when a Gurkha kingdom was established. I think the Afghani pulwar fully matured from the Deccani/ N. Indian cup-like form into a full “ pulwar one” not earlier than 17-18 century. If we combine the calendars, my guess the “ Indian-Afghani” swords came into existence not earlier than that. Just a guess. |
23rd November 2019, 10:16 AM | #7 | |
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Quote:
I believe in statistics when you have many cobra swords with Afghan hilts well... |
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23rd November 2019, 01:40 PM | #8 |
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It is very easy to attach a word “Afghani” to a bladed weapon when it has typical “pulwar” handle.
But if Elgood is right and there was a “ marriage of convenience” we may need to sit down and start thinking anew. Look at the series of pics shown by me: there are examples of Tulwar handle, modified basket handle ( Deccan?), unquestionable Pulwar and a modified Pulwar with downturned quillons but with an original S. Indian pommel. With this variety of handles how certain are we in our blanket definition as “ Indo-Afghani”? |
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