Mystery Dagger ID Help Needed

Robert · 13th August 2019, 09:43 PM

Hello Ken and thank you for your interest and reply. The wood is an extremely hard variety and I imagine would not be very easily carved. Do you recognize the carving as being of an Irish or Scottish form? I will add a few more photos showing the carving at the end of the hilt a bit better.

Best,
Robert

Rich · 13th August 2019, 10:05 PM

Have you noticed that the blade back extends past the guard? To my untrained eye that is not a mark of quality workmanship.
Rich

Rick · 13th August 2019, 10:28 PM

Repurposed blade?
I seem to remember wavy bladed daggers from small ads in the back pages of Argosy and other similar magazines of the fifties. I think the hilts were spiral with a ball and claw pommel.

Robert · 13th August 2019, 10:58 PM

Hello Rich,
I agree that the guards fitment is not the best that I have seen either, but the quality workmanship of the blade with its inserted hardened edge I believe more than makes up for it. I have seen and owned many daggers from Southeast Asia both with and without this style of blade that originally were never fitted with a guard of any kind.

Best,
Robert

Robert · 13th August 2019, 11:10 PM

Quote:

I seem to remember wavy bladed daggers from small ads in the back pages of Argosy and other similar magazines of the fifties. I think the hilts were spiral with a ball and claw pommel.

Hello Rick,
I not only remember the daggers you are talking about, but somewhere around here I still have one that I paid the grand total of $1.50 for in the late fifties.

Most of these were of German manufacture (like the one I still have) but I believe some were of Japanese origin as well. I can with confidence say that the blade of this piece definitely does not come from one of those daggers.

Best,
Robert

P.S. I meant to add that if you look at the first two photos of the complete dagger above you will see one where the blade was just cleaned and one where it has received a vinegar etch. In the lower photos of the blade only you can clearly see the inserted hardened steel edge.

Kmaddock · 14th August 2019, 09:33 AM

Hi Robert

see this discussion below.

Carving is totally different but I see a lot of similarities in style
due to the hardness the carving is generally quiet primitive.

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=22655

when you rub the handle does it fee sort of oily, no residue just a greasy feel

Regards

Ken

Richard G · 15th August 2019, 06:04 PM

Wheat etc. carved on a handle I would normally associate with a bread knife.
Regards
Richard

Ian · 15th August 2019, 11:30 PM

Hi Robert:

Interesting dagger. I think the hilt likely does not depict wheat, but rather a seed pod with the seeds emerging from the pod. Wheat does not have a pod like this, so something else. The steel (?) ferrule does not look Filipino to me, and the brass disk might well be made from a polished coin (Does it have a slight rim to the edge? Hard to tell from the pics.).

No idea where it is from, but I don't think it is Filipino.

Regards,

Ian.

Mel H · 29th August 2019, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard G

Wheat etc. carved on a handle I would normally associate with a bread knife.
Regards
Richard

I do see a lot of elderly bread knives with this style of handle here in the north of England, more often made from pine.

13th August 2019, 10:58 PM	#4
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	Hello Rich, I agree that the guards fitment is not the best that I have seen either, but the quality workmanship of the blade with its inserted hardened edge I believe more than makes up for it. I have seen and owned many daggers from Southeast Asia both with and without this style of blade that originally were never fitted with a guard of any kind. Best, Robert Last edited by Robert; 14th August 2019 at 12:00 AM.

13th August 2019, 09:43 PM	#1
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	Hello Ken and thank you for your interest and reply. The wood is an extremely hard variety and I imagine would not be very easily carved. Do you recognize the carving as being of an Irish or Scottish form? I will add a few more photos showing the carving at the end of the hilt a bit better. Best, Robert

13th August 2019, 10:05 PM	#2
Rich Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: comfortably at home, USA Posts: 432	Have you noticed that the blade back extends past the guard? To my untrained eye that is not a mark of quality workmanship. Rich

13th August 2019, 10:28 PM	#3
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,267	Repurposed blade? I seem to remember wavy bladed daggers from small ads in the back pages of Argosy and other similar magazines of the fifties. I think the hilts were spiral with a ball and claw pommel.

14th August 2019, 09:33 AM	#6
Kmaddock Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: Ireland Posts: 533	Hi Robert see this discussion below. Carving is totally different but I see a lot of similarities in style due to the hardness the carving is generally quiet primitive. http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=22655 when you rub the handle does it fee sort of oily, no residue just a greasy feel Regards Ken

15th August 2019, 06:04 PM	#7
Richard G Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 402	Wheat etc. carved on a handle I would normally associate with a bread knife. Regards Richard

15th August 2019, 11:30 PM	#8
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,042	Hi Robert: Interesting dagger. I think the hilt likely does not depict wheat, but rather a seed pod with the seeds emerging from the pod. Wheat does not have a pod like this, so something else. The steel (?) ferrule does not look Filipino to me, and the brass disk might well be made from a polished coin (Does it have a slight rim to the edge? Hard to tell from the pics.). No idea where it is from, but I don't think it is Filipino. Regards, Ian.