Indian Katar ,tourist maybe ?

[ariel]

I am absolutely certain that every participant on this Forum is very well aware of the Sepoy Rebellion, aka Great Mutiny, or India’s First War of Independence:-)


But it had nothing to do with the demise of Katar as a weapon. On the contrary, if anything, the post-war British-inspired revitalization of local production of the old-style weapons by the workshops in the princely states delayed its disappearance. The author of the previous comment is well advised to consult books on the Marlborough House and Sandringham collections. A great number of weapons gifted by the Rajahs to the Prince of Wales in 1875-6 were newly made. Also, textual parts of Elgood’s books on Jaipur and Jodhpur Arsenals may be extremely informative. I would strongly advise careful reading of those sources before making rash and naive statements that on top of everything else have no relation to the topic of this discussion.

Bladed weapons, like most other traditions, do not appear or disappear overnight or as a result of a single incident; it is always a gradual but inexorable process. The book by Kirill Rivkin on the evolution of saber analyzes it in great detail and needs to be studied carefully.

[Jens Nordlunde]

Thank you for showing the details.
If it is from Bundi, two fish at the hilt base would make sence, as they, the former rulers of Delhi, were Hindu's, belonging to the Hara subclan of the Chauhans.


Thank you Ariel for 'pushing' the discussion back on trail:-).

[Kubur]

Originally Posted by Jens Nordlunde

Thank you Ariel for 'pushing' the discussion back on trail:-).

Well actually it was Ariel who put it off road with some general comments on touristic katar...


I don't think it's fair to compare Elgood with his amazing books full of details, notes and well grounded litterature and Rivkin 's last book grounded partially on opinions a bit like on this forum... It's not the same league and not the same topic...

[mahratt]

Originally Posted by Kubur

I don't think it's fair to compare Elgood with his amazing books full of details, notes and well grounded litterature and Rivkin 's last book grounded partially on opinions a bit like on this forum... It's not the same league and not the same topic...

In the Russian language there is an expression "hand washes a hand" (from the Latin expression "Manus manum lavat"). Its meaning is that friends will always praise each other

[ariel]

I do not wish to engage in this type of discussion.
If anybody here wants to open a separate topic addressing pros and cons of various books on the subject, I shall be happy to add my 2 cents worth.

Provided, of course, that I had been able to read and comprehend them in their entirety.

[Kubur]

Please don't be mistaken
I'm following your posts, Ariel, and i like or agree with some of them.
BUT Rivkin, with all my respect, has nothing to do with this katar.
I think it's an on-going discussion between Maratt and you.
As the Indian weapon forum guru Jens said let's come back to the topic.

[ALEX]

Originally Posted by Kubur

Please don't be mistaken
I'm following your posts, Ariel, and i like or agree with some of them.
BUT Rivkin, with all my respect, has nothing to do with this katar.
I think it's an on-going discussion between Maratt and you.
As the Indian weapon forum guru Jens said let's come back to the topic.

I disagree with your earlier comparison between R. Elgood and K. Rivkin as well as the above comment. Both authors are experienced researchers in their field of study, and present valuable material and analysis. What Ariel mentioned about Mr. Rivkin's book was not about a particular weapon, but about analysis of evolution/development of a weapon in general. K. Rivkin's book follows that approach, as should anyone studying and/or researching.
Are we on the same topic

[mahratt]

Originally Posted by ariel

But it had nothing to do with the demise of Katar as a weapon. On the contrary, if anything, the post-war British-inspired revitalization of local production of the old-style weapons by the workshops in the princely states delayed its disappearance. The author of the previous comment is well advised to consult books on the Marlborough House and Sandringham collections. A great number of weapons gifted by the Rajahs to the Prince of Wales in 1875-6 were newly made. Also, textual parts of Elgood’s books on Jaipur and Jodhpur Arsenals may be extremely informative. I would strongly advise careful reading of those sources before making rash and naive statements that on top of everything else have no relation to the topic of this discussion.

I wonder how the weapons made for the Prince of Wales and other "collectors" are associated with the use of katar in real battles?))) Nobody argues with what the kathars did for Europeans and Maharajas after the sepoy rebellion) But maybe you know the fact that the prince of Wales or someone from the Maharajas in the late 19th century fought using katar? Unfortunately, this fact is not known to me. But you, as the forum patriarch, undoubtedly know better than me. So I held my breath and got ready to listen to you)