Beduin "pseudoshashka"

ariel · 23rd January 2017, 09:37 PM

This is my third one: a saif of beduins from Sinai/Negev.
European blade, shortened ( 25" straight line). Simple white brass decorations on the handle, yellow brass on the scabbard.
New leathery stuff ( suede?) covers the middle part of the scabbard, underneath old darkened wood. All firmly held together.

This is a true "pseudoshashka": has nothing to do with the Caucasus, but just a simple ergonomic design reminiscent of Sardinian Leppa and sabers of Croatian/Slovenian Krajsniks.
I think Motan will especially like it:-))

Oliver Pinchot · 23rd January 2017, 10:16 PM

An especially nice example, Ariel.

motan · 23rd January 2017, 10:27 PM

Hi Ariel. Very nice one. Not common with scabbard and almost nothing missing. They are charming despite the primitive workmanship. Notice the style of decoration with bulges is similar to my shybriya.
Probably not its first scabbard though. The sword itself looks well used and might have been used in combat, because the Negev in the later half of the 19th c was the scene of several relatively large scale tribal wars between the Tiyaha, al Azazme and the Tarabin.

TVV · 23rd January 2017, 11:29 PM

Very nice Ariel, thank you for sharing. As simple as these are, they seem to have quite a variety when it comes to blades and handle decoration.

ariel · 24th January 2017, 01:34 AM

Thanks guys!
I am glad you enjoyed the show.

The clan wars never ceased, and Tarabins still rule the roost. Nothing changed since the times of Ramses, Tutmos and Moses....

BTW: Should I remove this ugly faux suede from the scabbard?

A.alnakkas · 26th January 2017, 07:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ariel

Thanks guys!
I am glad you enjoyed the show.

The clan wars never ceased, and Tarabins still rule the roost. Nothing changed since the times of Ramses, Tutmos and Moses....

BTW: Should I remove this ugly faux suede from the scabbard?

A very fine example. I never owned these, but Artzi shows a finer example. Any other in the collection, Ariel?

As for the suede, whats beneath it?

motan · 26th January 2017, 10:26 AM

Faux suede? Seriously? Yes you should remove it, but I wouldn't know what to replace it with and the wood underneath is probably ugly. I suspect that the original cover was not brilliant either. The minimal solution would be to rearrange it so that is does not cover the brass. Still a very nice sword..

Jim McDougall · 26th January 2017, 08:08 PM

A fascinating example Ariel!
Also quite unusual in my view with my limited exposure to these, however what I recognize most is the character of the hilt in form, which seems pretty consistent with these.

What I might add, it seems like this scabbard and in degree perhaps the decoration en suite on the hilt, might relate to the distinctive sa'if forms of Hadhra'maut. Elgood shows these in "Arms and Armour of Arabia" with highly embossed or worked silver sheeting with a long chape sleeve extending far up the scabbard, and there is metal banding spaced over a red velveteen backing. With these however there is a receiver in the scabbard throat for the langet, of course absent on these Bedouin sabres.

Is it possible that this distinct style of motif from Hadhramaut and perhaps Yemeni regions with high relief sheeted metal and the banding over velveteen might have been replicated by a Bedouin influenced by these designs?

As Ariel notes, these Palestinian/Sinai Bedouin sabres were usually quite simple ergonomic weapons, which indeed have virtually always been in use in the constant volatility in remote tribal regions.

ariel · 26th January 2017, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A.alnakkas

......Artzi shows a finer example...

Well, it is difficult to compete with Artzi's personal collection, especially taking into account his proximity to the source. His scabbard is complete.

Mine are simpler and have more "kisses of time" ( translation: damages)

A.alnakkas · 27th January 2017, 08:20 AM

Excellent examples. Appears to me that the smiths who assembled these swords did not use this form alone, as the engraving style reminds me of a crude saif I once had that followed the exact patterns but of a more nejdi style hilt. The engraving reminds me most of the silver example owned by Artzi shown in the gallery.

Artzi's example: http://www.oriental-arms.com/photos.php?id=67

Included are images of the saif

Jim McDougall · 27th January 2017, 08:24 PM

QUESTION:
Could the banded decoration and the embossed metal scabbard mounts seen in the OP be the result of Hadhamauti influence as per sa'if examples in Elgood ('Arabian Arms') ?

23rd January 2017, 09:37 PM	#1
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Beduin "pseudoshashka" This is my third one: a saif of beduins from Sinai/Negev. European blade, shortened ( 25" straight line). Simple white brass decorations on the handle, yellow brass on the scabbard. New leathery stuff ( suede?) covers the middle part of the scabbard, underneath old darkened wood. All firmly held together. This is a true "pseudoshashka": has nothing to do with the Caucasus, but just a simple ergonomic design reminiscent of Sardinian Leppa and sabers of Croatian/Slovenian Krajsniks. I think Motan will especially like it:-)) Attached Images

23rd January 2017, 10:27 PM	#3
motan Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Jerusalem Posts: 274	Nice Hi Ariel. Very nice one. Not common with scabbard and almost nothing missing. They are charming despite the primitive workmanship. Notice the style of decoration with bulges is similar to my shybriya. Probably not its first scabbard though. The sword itself looks well used and might have been used in combat, because the Negev in the later half of the 19th c was the scene of several relatively large scale tribal wars between the Tiyaha, al Azazme and the Tarabin.

26th January 2017, 10:26 AM	#7
motan Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Jerusalem Posts: 274	Faux suede Faux suede? Seriously? Yes you should remove it, but I wouldn't know what to replace it with and the wood underneath is probably ugly. I suspect that the original cover was not brilliant either. The minimal solution would be to rearrange it so that is does not cover the brass. Still a very nice sword..

27th January 2017, 08:20 AM	#10
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,338	Excellent examples. Appears to me that the smiths who assembled these swords did not use this form alone, as the engraving style reminds me of a crude saif I once had that followed the exact patterns but of a more nejdi style hilt. The engraving reminds me most of the silver example owned by Artzi shown in the gallery. Artzi's example: http://www.oriental-arms.com/photos.php?id=67 Included are images of the saif Attached Images

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23rd January 2017, 10:16 PM	#2
Oliver Pinchot Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 456	An especially nice example, Ariel.

23rd January 2017, 11:29 PM	#4
TVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Bay Area Posts: 1,597	Very nice Ariel, thank you for sharing. As simple as these are, they seem to have quite a variety when it comes to blades and handle decoration.

24th January 2017, 01:34 AM	#5
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Thanks guys! I am glad you enjoyed the show. The clan wars never ceased, and Tarabins still rule the roost. Nothing changed since the times of Ramses, Tutmos and Moses.... BTW: Should I remove this ugly faux suede from the scabbard?

26th January 2017, 08:08 PM	#8
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,738	A fascinating example Ariel! Also quite unusual in my view with my limited exposure to these, however what I recognize most is the character of the hilt in form, which seems pretty consistent with these. What I might add, it seems like this scabbard and in degree perhaps the decoration en suite on the hilt, might relate to the distinctive sa'if forms of Hadhra'maut. Elgood shows these in "Arms and Armour of Arabia" with highly embossed or worked silver sheeting with a long chape sleeve extending far up the scabbard, and there is metal banding spaced over a red velveteen backing. With these however there is a receiver in the scabbard throat for the langet, of course absent on these Bedouin sabres. Is it possible that this distinct style of motif from Hadhramaut and perhaps Yemeni regions with high relief sheeted metal and the banding over velveteen might have been replicated by a Bedouin influenced by these designs? As Ariel notes, these Palestinian/Sinai Bedouin sabres were usually quite simple ergonomic weapons, which indeed have virtually always been in use in the constant volatility in remote tribal regions.

27th January 2017, 08:24 PM	#11
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,738	QUESTION: Could the banded decoration and the embossed metal scabbard mounts seen in the OP be the result of Hadhamauti influence as per sa'if examples in Elgood ('Arabian Arms') ?