Weapons of the Iberian Iron Age

[Gonzalo G]

Originally Posted by fernando

What would be the criteria ? The Celts started the Hallstatt C iron culture between 8th-5th Centuries BC. Then we had the La Tene culture, one developed from the late Hallstatt, which lasted untill Roman occupation (1st century BC).
Then perhaps we should also consider that the Iberian smiths, themselves owners of great imagination, improved, adjusted, decorated and put up their own sword versions. So, freely speaking, we are simultaneously discussing late Hallstatt and la Tene antena swords (Gladius Hispaniensis), and Falcatas, either of imported infuence or actual Iberian, for the matter; don't you agree ? .

You don't seem to be aware that the Iberian and the Celts were a different peoples. The Celts carried their weapons, Hallstatt and La Tene weapons, which were diffused all over the Peninsula in due time. The falcata was developed among the Iberians and latter diffused to many areas. Their cultures were slowly integrating. The falcatas are not the result of Celtic cultural phenomena, even if they coincide with the second Iron Age in the Peninsula. That is why I spoke that the falcatas does not follow a Celtic influx.

Originally Posted by fernando

This issue has apparently been discussed by countless academics, some in favour, some opposing and some even hesitating on the Gereek/Medierranean origin; what we may call discussing the sex of angels.

Yes, I know this discussion, I only pretended to expose it here, especially when some of its aspects are not well known and the prevalent ideas seem to be inaccurate. But if you don't want me to do it, it is ok.

Originally Posted by fernando

Quesada Sans pretends that the first version of Falcata ( the Fronton type) arose in the South of the Peninsula (actual Spain) by the 6th-5th century BC, while by the 4th century BC large parts of the Peninsula were 'flooded' with Falcatas. This is consistent with countless findings, which extended to mid South Portuguese Alcacer do Sal, one of the largest amount of La Tene and Falcatas found, not in the open, but in a necropolis context.


Follow the charts ... which you are aware of several .

Then again, I know the charts, I only wanted to set the problem in a way I considered an organized manner to develop the following exposition, which I planned to make in later posts for further discussion. My words were a sort of preamble. I also wanted to share some discoveries I made about the machaira and its presence in Central Asia, not as a Greek weapon. Maybe I choose the wrong way.

Originally Posted by fernando

Having all answers, is not so fun .

No, but we never have all the answers. My personal experience is that new answers create new questions. Anyway, what is this forum for if not to answer some questions?

Thank you

Bye

[fernando]

Originally Posted by Gonzalo G

... You don't seem to be aware that the Iberian and the Celts were a different peoples...

Oh, i am aware of that, even in a non scholar basis; i must have made a wrong punctuation in my approach to the subject .

Originally Posted by Gonzalo G

... The Celts carried their weapons, Hallstatt and La Tene weapons, which were diffused all over the Peninsula in due time. The falcata was developed among the Iberians and latter diffused to many areas. Their cultures were slowly integrating. The falcatas are not the result of Celtic cultural phenomena, even if they coincide with the second Iron Age in the Peninsula. That is why I spoke that the falcatas does not follow a Celtic influx...

Again i must have made myself misunderstood.
On the other hand, i would i reflect some perplexity about this whole issue.
I recall a question often posed (also here) on where the Falcata came from, which implicates that such weapon was not purely invented by Iberians as from zero square.
What an amalgama of races and tribes, Romans having one idea of how they mixed and were based in the territory and current academics having diverted perspectives.
Iberians and Celts were a different people yes, to a certain extent and timeline. Isn't it said that the Celts not only coexisted but also mixed with the Iberos in the Central Meseta, reason for the appearing of Celtiberos, a thing different from Iberian Celts. But ...didn't all these peoples miscigenate ? No surprise if the Iberians (also) handled swords of Celtic Hallstatt tradition while the Celtiberos (also) had falcatized swords ?
While not a surprise that the ratio of falcatas found in the Southern part of the Peninsula versus other swords is overwhelming (98%) it is nevertheless symptomatic that in the (now Portuguese) West Coast, necropolis findings denoted a slightly majority of falcatas versus La Tene antena swords.
I think of the Celts confederating with the Lusitanians of Viriato; which swords would then be in this so called 'Roman Terror' general's panoplia to push back the Romans; only La Tene type sword or also the Falcata ?
Still lots of ink shall be spent about this issue.

Originally Posted by Gonzalo G

...Anyway, what is this forum for if not to answer some questions ?...

By all means, Gonzalo; who said the contrary ?


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