Luzon sword for comment

Lew · 13th February 2013, 10:36 AM

As far as a Mexican connection in the Philippine goes

. Notice the guard style it the same as the other two daggers.

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...lippine+dagger

Robert · 13th February 2013, 07:19 PM

Hello Lew,
I am not saying that this is not from the Philippines, I was just pointing out a few things about it that make me wonder about it. This could very well be Philippine but just with more Mexican influence than I am used to seeing. What makes me think that this could be a later piece (1940 or later) can be seen in the second picture down from the top that shows how pointed the waves are, which is something that I have seen on quite a few later Philippine pieces. A very interesting piece where ever it is from.

Best,
Robert

VVV · 13th February 2013, 08:13 PM

This is not my area but I think it is Luzon, even if the hilt is unusual.
Here is a kris with a resembling guard that clearly is not Mexican.

Michael

Robert · 13th February 2013, 08:38 PM

Hello Michael,
I cannot say for sure without seeing the end of the hilt on your friends sword but I do not think that it is a Luzon piece but more from the Visayans. As for the guard, the people of the Philippines were very resourceful and would re-use all sorts of items. I even have a dagger that has Chinese thimbles being used as ferrules.

Best,
Robert

VVV · 13th February 2013, 08:43 PM

Hello Robert,

Sorry for being unclear - it was the kris from eBay that I thought was from Luzon.
According to the seller (of the eBay kris) the sheath is too small for the blade so maybe it doesn't belong to it?

Michael

Sajen · 13th February 2013, 10:11 PM

Thank you all for this (now) very interesting discussion! I don't know much about Mexican swords but never have seen a waved sword from there.

Is someone able to show examples?

Robert · 13th February 2013, 10:50 PM

Michael, Sorry for misunderstanding what you were saying.

As for the scabbard, if it was made from un-aged wood it could have shrunk so much that the blade no longer fits. It does however look like it is original to the sword. Like I said, this could very well be from Luzon it is just that I have never seen this grip (bird carving) on a Philippine item before but I have seen this style on items from Mexico as well as wavy blades. I am quite sure that there are numerous styles of Luzon swords, knives and daggers that I haven't seen yet and this could very well be one of them.

Detlef, There have been quite a few wavy bladed daggers listed on epray over the years that were clearly marked as being made in Mexico with horn hilts. I, like you have never seen a wavy bladed sword from Mexico yet but like Philippine items I am positive that I have never seen all the styles that have been made there over the years. Like I said earlier, this could very well be Philippine but just with more Mexican influence than I am used to seeing.

Best,
Robert

13th February 2013, 08:13 PM	#3
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	This is not my area but I think it is Luzon, even if the hilt is unusual. Here is a kris with a resembling guard that clearly is not Mexican. Michael Attached Images

13th February 2013, 10:36 AM	#1
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	As far as a Mexican connection in the Philippine goes . Notice the guard style it the same as the other two daggers. http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...lippine+dagger

13th February 2013, 07:19 PM	#2
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	Hello Lew, I am not saying that this is not from the Philippines, I was just pointing out a few things about it that make me wonder about it. This could very well be Philippine but just with more Mexican influence than I am used to seeing. What makes me think that this could be a later piece (1940 or later) can be seen in the second picture down from the top that shows how pointed the waves are, which is something that I have seen on quite a few later Philippine pieces. A very interesting piece where ever it is from. Best, Robert

13th February 2013, 08:38 PM	#4
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	Hello Michael, I cannot say for sure without seeing the end of the hilt on your friends sword but I do not think that it is a Luzon piece but more from the Visayans. As for the guard, the people of the Philippines were very resourceful and would re-use all sorts of items. I even have a dagger that has Chinese thimbles being used as ferrules. Best, Robert

13th February 2013, 08:43 PM	#5
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Hello Robert, Sorry for being unclear - it was the kris from eBay that I thought was from Luzon. According to the seller (of the eBay kris) the sheath is too small for the blade so maybe it doesn't belong to it? Michael

13th February 2013, 10:11 PM	#6
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,574	Thank you all for this (now) very interesting discussion! I don't know much about Mexican swords but never have seen a waved sword from there. Is someone able to show examples?

13th February 2013, 10:50 PM	#7
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	Michael, Sorry for misunderstanding what you were saying. As for the scabbard, if it was made from un-aged wood it could have shrunk so much that the blade no longer fits. It does however look like it is original to the sword. Like I said, this could very well be from Luzon it is just that I have never seen this grip (bird carving) on a Philippine item before but I have seen this style on items from Mexico as well as wavy blades. I am quite sure that there are numerous styles of Luzon swords, knives and daggers that I haven't seen yet and this could very well be one of them. Detlef, There have been quite a few wavy bladed daggers listed on epray over the years that were clearly marked as being made in Mexico with horn hilts. I, like you have never seen a wavy bladed sword from Mexico yet but like Philippine items I am positive that I have never seen all the styles that have been made there over the years. Like I said earlier, this could very well be Philippine but just with more Mexican influence than I am used to seeing. Best, Robert